horn bow (non traditional)

[superdav95]

I figured Id post this here as its a non traditional horn bow build.  The length is closer to 58" oal. it pulls about 57lbs at 27". its a bamboo core with buff horn belly slats and 3 layers of sinew covered with goat skin. ive just got hideous color bindings on there to hold it all together to test for now but will re do those later.  the siyahs are maple with buff horn reinforcements. Its non traditional in the sense that its put together in five pieces like my standard 5 piece bows but just added horn and sinew.  Ive been wanting to test this idea out for awhile.  I was very impressed with the speed and recovery of the limbs of this bow.  lots going on with a bow like this so ive been taking my time with it getting to this point.  seems to have taken no set likely due to the sinew.  time will tell once i do some more shooting out to full draw.  anyway check it out ill keep updates coming.  I did a quick video for the heck of it and got a unusually fast reading.  most of my reading while shooting today at 3/4 draw were around 190-192.  maybe a cleaner release perhaps.  Anyway it seems quite fast and snappy.  There is more speed in this bow yet so more to come. 

Video clip

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/9yyi45sb0axzn2tpgj20i/IMG_8509.MOV?rlkey=sr6tclrnwwcgnl8x0ufh27fl7&dl=0

[Hamish]

Shoots well and looks really well made.
How would you rate the non trad method vs the trad method in terms of results/ appearance, ease of manufacturing?

[superdav95]

Shoots well and looks really well made.
How would you rate the non trad method vs the trad method in terms of results/ appearance, ease of manufacturing?

Thanks hamish!  Ya way easier to build this one but that’s not saying much I guess.  At the end of the day It’s still horn and sinew and wood essentially.  I used modern glue to glue all the 5 pieces together and then served with thread.  The nice thing about this little bow is that I can take it apart in its 5 pieces with little heat if any part of it fails.  In fact I’ve built 3 bows using these parts over last couple years.  I do this to test out some theories or hair brained ideas.  As far as performance comparison it’s about the same.  The 5 piece variant is little heavier (710grams) in the hand and I think it’s little nicer to shoot and obviously string up.  It’s basically a practical horn bow.  Once I tillered it and braced it all good.  This is not necessarily the case that I’ve seen with traditional horn bows which take balancing and twist sorted out often.  A warming up period and preflexing does not seem to be necessary with this bow.  Time will tell on durability.  As it is now it took no set or lost any of its reflex due to the sinew.  No weird issues with the horn either.  It spits out an arrow pretty good.  I’m gonna tweek things a bit more yet.  More to come. 

[bassman211]

Impressive bow. Well done. Good arrow velocity. I have made a dozen or, so bows with just a bamboo slat for limbs with riser , and siyahs made from rock maple. They do OK, but they are shorter, lighter weight bows, and I shoot a short draw, so the 180's  Would never happen for me, but still fun shooting. Like your bow I cut arrow shelves in mine.

[razorbak]

Wow you never fail to impress me. Very cool

[superdav95]

Impressive bow. Well done. Good arrow velocity. I have made a dozen or, so bows with just a bamboo slat for limbs with riser , and siyahs made from rock maple. They do OK, but they are shorter, lighter weight bows, and I shoot a short draw, so the 180's  Would never happen for me, but still fun shooting. Like your bow I cut arrow shelves in mine.

Thanks bassman!   Ya I’ve seen you post one of them a while back.  It looked good.    The key to getting good speed out of these is heat treating you bamboo correctly and getting moisture out.  the other thing with draw length is making them about 60” oal so the limbs sections are about 25” with the siyahs adding the extra length.  If you are interested I can share some other things I’ve observed with these bow that can get you there if interested. 

[superdav95]

Wow you never fail to impress me. Very cool

Thanks razorbak!   

[mmattockx]

the siyahs are maple with buff horn reinforcements.

Dave, I love seeing your experiments. What are you reinforcing with the horn on the siyahs? Is this for string wear or structural? The maple should be lighter and will be significantly stiffer than the horn if you were worried about the structure. Where do you get such large, flat pieces of horn?

Its non traditional in the sense that its put together in five pieces like my standard 5 piece bows but just added horn and sinew.

You will have to enlighten me, how does just adding horn and sinew differ from a traditional 5 piece bow?

Can you share what modern glue you used for this?


Mark

[superdav95]

the siyahs are maple with buff horn reinforcements.

Dave, I love seeing your experiments. What are you reinforcing with the horn on the siyahs? Is this for string wear or structural? The maple should be lighter and will be significantly stiffer than the horn if you were worried about the structure. Where do you get such large, flat pieces of horn?

Its non traditional in the sense that its put together in five pieces like my standard 5 piece bows but just added horn and sinew.

You will have to enlighten me, how does just adding horn and sinew differ from a traditional 5 piece bow?

Can you share what modern glue you used for this?


Mark

Thanks mark.  Ya I used ca glue to apply the horn reinforcement horn onto the maple levers.  It’s is more to prevent string from cutting into maple as the grain runs lengthwise.  It’s also for string wear I guess too.  Not so much structural.   As far as the glue I used to assemble the 5 pieces together prior to binding with thread I use dewalt brand dual hot glue sticks.  These seem to hold up well so long as you serve it after.  I’ve built these little bows with all sort of different glue types to test out even a couple with Hide glue wrapped with sinew.  Stanley is another brand I’ve used also that works.  Any hot melt glue stick so long as it’s used for heavy duty and for use in the higher heat glue guns. 

I meant that it’s non traditional horn bow in comparison to solid wood core of say mulberry or maple that may have v spliced syahs all carved and shaped as a complete core before horn is applied and then sinew.  My little bow here is merely an experiment to see if a successful 5 piece Asiatic style bow could be made and taken apart if needed.  I did not build this as a take down 5 piece build but it could be.  So far my tests are looking good.  The horn is hold up well and sinew does not seem stressed. 

I got my horn from Noorbaba in India.  I ordered a bunch of it while back and just working through it.  They were all nice a straight when I got them but over time they twist up a bit back original shape.  Nothing a little heat can’t fix. 

[mmattockx]

As far as the glue I used to assemble the 5 pieces together prior to binding with thread I use dewalt brand dual hot glue sticks. 

 

Hot glue, awesome. I like hearing about this sort of stuff, technology never stops moving and we can all learn new tricks.

I meant that it’s non traditional horn bow in comparison to solid wood core of say mulberry or maple that may have v spliced syahs all carved and shaped as a complete core before horn is applied and then sinew. 

OK, now I understand.

I got my horn from Noorbaba in India.  I ordered a bunch of it while back and just working through it.  They were all nice a straight when I got them but over time they twist up a bit back original shape.  Nothing a little heat can’t fix.

When you say 'buffalo' I envision the north american plains type. I see you meant water buffalo, which makes more sense to me now.


Mark

[willie]

Hot glue, awesome. I like hearing about this sort of stuff, technology never stops moving and we can all learn new tricks.

heres one with twine binding and " I used Swix blue cross country ski wax
between levers and limbs"

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/paleoplanet69529/alaskan-take-down-molly-build-along-broken-and-fix-t54709.html

Dave, I have been trying to get the pics to load for three days, keeps timing out here

edit: finally loaded the pics,  sweet bow   

[superdav95]

Hot glue, awesome. I like hearing about this sort of stuff, technology never stops moving and we can all learn new tricks.

heres one with twine binding and " I used Swix blue cross country ski wax
between levers and limbs"

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/paleoplanet69529/alaskan-take-down-molly-build-along-broken-and-fix-t54709.html

Dave, I have been trying to get the pics to load for three days, keeps timing out here

edit: finally loaded the pics,  sweet bow

Thanks Willie!  Ya I had a look at the link you posted here. Very interesting indeed.  I’ve done something very similar using bamboo limbs instead of red oak boards.  It was to be a take down style similar but with only one of the limbs and wraps removable and the other more permanently affixed with bindings.  Unfortunately this bow broke a limb and I salvaged the part to use for another build.  It’s on my list of things to revisit for sure. So many ideas out there and innovative designs.  I love to hear of folks thinking outside the box and not getting stuck on what has been done and wonder what could be.    Very cool.   I don’t think I will ever conform to preconceived ideas.  It’s not my nature.  This doesn’t mean I don’t respect the efforts and knowledge or skill of those before I just don’t want to limit myself to it.  There’s a lot of guys out there that think this way and are doing some amazing stuff!   

[mmattockx]

heres one with twine binding and " I used Swix blue cross country ski wax
between levers and limbs"

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/paleoplanet69529/alaskan-take-down-molly-build-along-broken-and-fix-t54709.html

That is certainly something different, very cool.


Mark