Bare shaft tuning

[DC]

My name is Don and I have trouble bare shaft tuning
Rather than put this on Todd's post I thought it should have its own thread. I break arrows when I bare shaft so I rarely do it any more but I know it's the best way to tune. I've tried standing close to the target. It didn't help. I know that when I use my shooting machine which is about 2 yards from it's target I break shafts or arrows whether they are spined right or not. I had to go with a swinging swivelling target and carbon test arrows to stop that. I'm not convinced that standing close is the answer. I know what spine my bow likes so I start with shafts close to that. When I bare shaft in the back yard I use a Bulldog target, maybe that's it. Maybe I should use a swivelling target but then could I trust the angle the arrow ends up at.
I'm wondering if there is a way to kind of sneak up on it rather than go full draw from step one. Could a person stand at a reasonable distance and start with half draw or less and see where/how the shaft hits and then work toward it hitting right by drawing further and correcting the spine as you go? I can't wrap my head around the consequences of doing it this way. Maybe someone already does this? I use bamboo arrows and there is a ton of work into them by the time they're ready for bare shafting. Don't want to risk breaking them with bare shafting. Especially when I can fletch them up and they will fly well enough for my level of shooting.
I realise that people do bare shaft successfully so I'm probably doing something wrong but I have spent a lot of time and arrows trying to get past breaking so many.

[artcher1]

Do you only have this problem with bamboo arrows DC?

[DC]

That's a tough one I've only made a few non-bamboo arrows so I'm not sure. I haven't actually made that many arrows compared to some people. Maybe 50 or so but since I just target shoot they last well once they're finished. The bamboo ones are almost bulletproof. It's just getting past bare shafting.

[artcher1]

I tried bare shafting once and I ended up breaking a few shafts. But I figured out you really don't need to bare shaft for these bows. Once you account for bow weight, arrow pass width, string material, point weight, arrow length and any weight forward our arrows fly about as good as there going to fly once fletched...…..Art

[willie]

Could a person stand at a reasonable distance and start with half draw or less and see where/how the shaft hits and then work toward it hitting right by drawing further and correcting the spine as you go?

hmmmm, if the arrow is overspined at full draw, wouldnt it be way more overspined at half draw? of course it wont hit quite as hard.

were the arrows you broke easily, overspined or underspined when you tested them?
generally one might buy a heavier shaft than needed to allow for more adjusting, rather than buying too light of an arrow and risk cutting it too short or removing too much tip weight

if breakages are more prevalent with one or the other, it might tell you to start with a a light weight point and add as needed or vice versa

[DC]

It didn't matter if they were over or under. If they hit the target at too much of an angle they broke.

"hmmmm, if the arrow is overspined at full draw, wouldnt it be way more overspined at half draw? of course it wont hit quite as hard."
So if you shoot at half draw it's always going to act stiffer? If the spine is too low, at half draw it will look good? So if I start at half draw and it shows underspined I should throw it away as it will always be underspined. If it shows overspined next time pull it further and it should get a little better. And like you say, if it's overspined it will be way overspined but it may survive.
Maybe I'll try again. I'll start with a real low draw so the arrow survives no matter what and work my way up until it starts to show it's true colours. If I do one arrow at a time it should only take a few shots to get them to the point where I can do normal bareshafting. Thanks Willie

[TSA]

even though i am a staunch advocate for bareshafting, i do find myself drifting away from it.
i am almost inclined to say- get as close as you can, based on the charts and personal experience.
 fletch up 6 shafts, 3 with broadheads 3 with field points.
 and try group tuning- its a very effective method if you are reasonably close to start with.
what got me thinking this way, many years ago i was shooting shafts that were 15# too weak in spine( lack of knowledge!!)
and my field point's grouped well, they flew well- and i put broadheads on and took deer with them. one day i decided to practice with the BH's and they all grouped consistently to the side- both groups were good- but just two distinct groups.
so now i broadhead tune, and if you dont hunt just get some vented 3 blades, they will fly well and less likely to plane while your setup is not perfect.
 and i was doing this all at about 15 to 18 yards

[willie]

Hey Wayne,

glad you posted that. It reminds me of another method that may help DC.

If you shoot through a paper target placed at least an arrowlength before the target, you can observe a keyhole type tear in the paper that may give you some indication of nock left/right/up/down. might have to chalk the tip with some collored chalk to mark where the tip went through. of course, a very soft target behind can prevent breakage.

[DC]

Wayne, that sounds great but you have to be able to shoot a group first
Willie, I tried paper training a few years back but I made the paper holding frame too small. Never got back to it. Might try that again too.

[Knoll]

Decent form is prerequisite for paper or bareshaft tuning. Imo, your mostly bad experience with bareshaft tuning and your comment about challenges to shooting groups is indicative of form issues. Good luck!

[Woodely]

Decent form is prerequisite for paper or bareshaft tuning. Imo, your mostly bad experience with bareshaft tuning and your comment about challenges to shooting groups is indicative of form issues. Good luck!

Sometimes we are to quick to blame the equipment when in fact its our form,  shooting style, release etc.. and the list goes on.

[bownarra]

When you make a new set of arrows leave one unfletched.
Shoot a group with the fletched shafts.
Don't change anything and shoot the bareshaft.
It should group with your fletched shafts.
If it doesn't refer to the above picture.