Author Topic: Big Hooks  (Read 4479 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline DC

  • Member
  • Posts: 10,396
Big Hooks
« on: February 06, 2018, 06:00:41 pm »
Just to double check something. In the picture there is a poor rendering of a recurve at full draw. You can see that the string never lifts off the end. Is the part of the recurve beyond the red line doing anything. Would it be better to cut it off to save weight on the tips. The red line might not be exactly in the right place by 1/2" or so.

Offline aaron

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,037
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2018, 07:05:47 pm »
I don't think that the part past the red line would do anything when drawn as shown
Ilwaco, Washington, USA
"Good wood makes great bows, but bad wood makes great bowyers"

Offline bradsmith2010

  • Member
  • Posts: 5,187
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2018, 08:12:42 pm »
+1 (-P

Offline PatM

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,737
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2018, 08:22:05 pm »
I don't think that the part past the red line would do anything when drawn as shown

   How about on the front end of the draw? ;)

Offline bjrogg

  • Member
  • Posts: 11,016
  • Cedar Pond
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2018, 08:43:02 pm »
Are you going to cut em off and tell us if there's any changes DC? (-P
Bjrogg
A hot cup of coffee and a beautiful sunrise

Offline aaron

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,037
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2018, 08:47:55 pm »
I don't think that the part past the red line would do anything when drawn as shown

   How about on the front end of the draw? ;)
I think they would only contribute if it were drawn further.
Ilwaco, Washington, USA
"Good wood makes great bows, but bad wood makes great bowyers"

Offline PatM

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,737
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2018, 08:51:39 pm »
I don't think that the part past the red line would do anything when drawn as shown

   How about on the front end of the draw? ;)
I think they would only contribute if it were drawn further.

 Recurving doesn't influence the early draw then?

Offline DC

  • Member
  • Posts: 10,396
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2018, 10:20:49 pm »
It influences the early draw by shortening the bow(string) doesn't it?

Offline DC

  • Member
  • Posts: 10,396
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2018, 10:25:21 pm »
Are you going to cut em off and tell us if there's any changes DC? (-P
Bjrogg

On the little Yew I did it was 35# before and 38# after(approx). If I do this one I will chrono it at 27" draw before and after with 10 gpp arrows and also check draw weight before and after. This one is OS and the tiller is a tad iffy. It fought me tooth and nail.

gutpile

  • Guest
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2018, 08:41:20 am »
the additional wood added to make curve will definitely add more handshock than speed...actually will decrease speed... gut

Offline PatM

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,737
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2018, 08:49:58 am »
    Definitely is a strong word.

Offline aaron

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,037
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2018, 08:53:08 am »
I don't think that the part past the red line would do anything when drawn as shown

   How about on the front end of the draw? ;)
I think they would only contribute if it were drawn further.

 Recurving doesn't influence the early draw then?
Recurving does influence the early draw by making the bow feel shorter. When at brace, the bow "acts" like it is only as long as the distance between the string contact points. The ends of the recurves are past this point, so they don't affect the early draw.
Pat- are you messing with us? Why don't you tell us what you think?
Ilwaco, Washington, USA
"Good wood makes great bows, but bad wood makes great bowyers"

Offline PatM

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,737
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2018, 09:24:11 am »
Just questioning sweeping statements and making sure nothing is overlooked.

  The statement "the recurve feels shorter"   needs "feels heavier" added to it as well.

 The other statement about the wood beyond the contact point adding handshock could be countered with "would the handshock disappear if the bow was drawn until total lift-off occurred?"

 Do recurves typically have handshock if partially drawn?

Offline aaron

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,037
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2018, 09:42:21 am »
Pat, yes, thank you . When I said "feel shorter" I should have included that this increases the early draw weight.
About the handshock- and the question "would hand shock disappear if the bow were drawn further?" If I understand it right , handshock would not disappear- it might even increase slightly because the tips would be traveling faster than if drawn partially. So, the handshock would be the same or worse, but the extra length of the recurve would have benefits independent of this. (string angle, further draw due to longer overall length of the bow) . Am I understanding this ?

Back to the question of weather cutting off the extra mass would reduce handshock- My gut says it would. Anything that decreases mass in a moving part of the limb should help if handshock is caused by the bow's mass "slamming back to brace" and imparting it's momentum to the hand. the amount it can shock your hand should be partly dependant on it's moving mass. f=ma? On the other hand, if you cut off the tips, there would be less mass but more tip speed, so the increased tip speed would possibly add to handshock, taking away some of the gains from less mass.

Reading this and other forums, handshock and it's causes don't seem to be as well understood as other aspects of bowyery

Ilwaco, Washington, USA
"Good wood makes great bows, but bad wood makes great bowyers"

Offline aaron

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,037
Re: Big Hooks
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2018, 09:53:24 am »
Are you going to cut em off and tell us if there's any changes DC? (-P
Bjrogg

On the little Yew I did it was 35# before and 38# after(approx). If I do this one I will chrono it at 27" draw before and after with 10 gpp arrows and also check draw weight before and after. This one is OS and the tiller is a tad iffy. It fought me tooth and nail.

This has me confused. Are you saying that you had a bow with geometry like the first diagram and you cut off a the part that never experienced lift-off and its draw weight increased??
Ilwaco, Washington, USA
"Good wood makes great bows, but bad wood makes great bowyers"