Bare shaft breakage

[DC]

Every time I try and make arrows out of Western Hemlock I break about half of them when I'm bare shafting them. I just broke one that was  3/8", 28" long, spined at 60#, barrelled and I was shooting it with a 40# bow. I thought I would start with a heavy spine since I was breaking so many. I would guess it hit about 3" nock right and broke flush to the target face. I was about 15' from the target. The log I made them from was green when I got it. It's been drying for about 1 -1 1/2 years in 2" x 3/8" blanks. This stuff has got to be stronger than Cedar so what do you think is going on?

[Del the cat]

If an arrow hits the boss travelling at an angle, the front end can go in straight 'cos that's the direction of travel. the back end then caries on moving on a line that is say 3 inches to one side and snaps off where the shaft is held rigid in the boss.
I know people have explained why they bare shaft test, and I do understand... but I still think it's a bit daft.
I jokingly say it's like trying to tune the handling of your car by driving it without tyres 
Del

[DC]

How do people manage to bare shaft PO Cedar. I'm used to bamboo and have had no problem with it.

[Knoll]

Bareshaft test regularly and broke maybe 2% of them. Cane, poc, poplar, sitka spruce, shoots, doug fir, etc..
I know roughly what shaft stiffness is going to work and begin testing with shafts whose static spine are somewhat less and which are longish.

[DC]

What do you shoot in to?

[Knoll]

Styrafoam-like blocks.

[TimBo]

A softer target might work better.  I use a burlap bag stuffed with mostly thin sheet foam, but also some plastic grocery bags, more burlap, etc.  The kind of foam you pack dishes with works well. 

[JW_Halverson]

Or hang up a thick rug or carpet on a line and shoot at that.  It will thump the material hard, the material will give way, and the arrowshaft will fall to the ground.

[gutpile]

why bareshaft woodies...makes no sense...no two will be identical.... gets in ballpark but really not necessary IMO ... gut

[TSA]

i broke many, many shafts  bareshafting,
frustrating and expensive!

the key to bareshafting is to check the charts- and get as close as you can with the spines, then when you start bareshafting- start close to the target.
i know this is counter-intuitive!
my thoughts were always if i got further from the target- there was less "power" in the shaft- the impact would be less- and the chance of breakage is reduced.

the fact is, the further you get from the target, the more exaggerated the error becomes, the more askance the arrow hits the target- and the higher the chance of breakage.

here is a link to what i think is the best video i have ever seen on bareshafting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGOPiriLbcM

what bow are you shooting, i can put up some charts for you.

as for targets- i use a styrofoam block- i think a more flexible rubber type block would be better. to absorb some of the impact.
but i am wary of stuffed  bag targets- as the density can vary in the bag- and the lay of the stuffing- can give a false reading.
but hey, if its working, then dont change it.

only problem with the styrofoam is target burn, so i rub a little hard soap on the first half of the shaft.
cheers.

[DC]

Thanks Wayne. Here is the bow I was using although I've had it happen with others. It's the 3rd post down after you click the link.
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,62436.30.html

[TSA]

western hemlock is great shafting material. i dont think thats the issue.
especially as it was not kiln dried as well.
its good old growth is it?
hemlock on the ground will rot the quickest of all the woods.
its kind of a pioneer tree- its usually the first one to come in after the alders and other pioneer plants.
but you did say this was a green log.
 i have broken premium sitka, Poc, Fir, etc doing the bareshafting wrong

[TSA]

beautiful bow by the way!
i really like it!!
just my kind of bow.

so no cut in shelf?
what kind of string?
set up to shoot like a self bow- but the recurves and the increased efficiency will want a stiffer spine.
thicker( B50) string will want a softer spine
i would look at the selfbow chart- and maybe err on the stiffer side.

[TSA]

here is a glass longbow type chart- not cut to center, but with a cut in shelf- but just use it as a reference.

[DC]

 Thanks Wayne, I use eight strand FF. I like the look off no shelf and I shoot just as poorly off my knuckle as off a shelf so I went that way.
I got the Hemlock from a dry land sort (Sayward Timber) just up the road. It was a 4' chunk about 2' in dia that they'd cut off. They gave it to me and even loaded it in the truck with a huge loader. In one section about 1/2" thick there is 30 rings but most of it would be in the 40 RPI range. The log had a tiny bit of twist but the shafts come out good. It just seems brittle but I'm comparing it with bamboo so maybe that's a bit unfair.