Need real advice on arrow spine and point weight

[CB57]

Thought I had some understanding of this. Thought wrong, apparently. Shot with other archers at Barryton shoot in Michigan last weekend, and asked how their arrows were spined for their bows. Mine seem way too stiff, shooting consistently left (right hand shooter). Some shooters had quite low spine weights, some had higher spine and heavier points. I've tried 125 to 190 gr field points and still not sure . 145 -160 seem closest with two different bows, two sets of arrows. Have read TBB on the subject. Still not shooting where I look. Will listen to all advice and sift for workability in my situation. Thank you in advance.

[willie]

research will get you the rules of thumb about good arrow flight, but sometimes getting everything tuned for the way "you" shoot can be challenging. I have shot with friends that could not shoot my setup well , nor could I shoot theirs well.

just curious, how wide is you arrow pass and what is your brace height?

[Pat B]

For selfbows I go about 10# under draw weight for arrow spine.
 When you buy commercial shafting the advertised spine is for a 28" arrow with a 125gr point. For each inch over 28" you can reduce the  spine by 5# (the opposite for under 28") and for every 25 grs over 125gr you can subtract 5#of spine weight(the opposite for under 125gr)
So, for a 30" arrow with an actual spine of 60# with a 150gr head the arrow will shoot like 45# spined 28" arrow

[ksnow]

Have you ruled out cross eye dominance being an issue? Are you shooting both eyes open?  I struggle with being left eye dominant and right handed.  I have to close on eye.

Kyle

[Pat B]

If you shoot instinctively, eye dominance isn't an issue. You are better shooting with both eyes open for depth perception with the binocular affect.

[CB57]

Not ignoring all y'all. Haven't been able to measure brace height on new bow yet, don't remember on old bow. Don't really know how to measure arrow-pass, so a little input there might help, and I'm right handed and right eye dominant, shoot instinctively both eyes open.
Update: measured my fistmele (I know that's outdated) at just over 6", and new bow is about 1/2" above that right now. Sinew backed osage flatbow, with cut-in rest, drawing 45 # @ 28" (I used to draw 29", but age may have changed that.) Big bow is a 58# Jerry Hill Wildcat. I think brace height is 6 1/4" but that might not be right. Will check tonight. Thank you for your patience. The more I think I know about this noble pursuit, the more I find I am ignorant of.

[Pat B]

I use my fistmele to check brace height on most of my bows.
 My bows are symmetrical. The center of the handle is the center of the bow from tip to tip. I place my middle finger on the center line and mark the top of my hand for the arrow pass. For an asymmetrical bow mark the center and go up 1 1/2" and down 2 1/2" for a 4" handle

[steve b.]

What is your arrow spine?  Doesn't matter what change your point weight is if your spine is way too heavy.  Assuming you spined everything to match fairly closely to your bow then I'd have someone else with experience shoot the bow.  What is your experience with shooting?  How center shot is the bow?
I have a very nice osage/sinewed flat bow that would rarely fling an arrow straight, unless everything was perfect.  But it was inconsistent and arrows would wobble side to side most of the time, no matter would I did.  I kind of abandoned the bow for a year or more.  One day I took it out, took the handle wrap and shelf off, flipped the bow over, and shot it off my hand.  Shoots great, almost always.  Its just happier off the other side.
When troubleshooting i move the arrow nock and brace through their extremes.

[CB57]

Set up my Ace Spinemaster in a new work space last night and started testing my arrows. One set , parallel lodgepole pine, spined between 54 and 65 pounds! Bought as 55-60. Hm. With that much variation, I'm going to have to weigh them, too.

[PEARL DRUMS]

I was shocked at my "matched" sets as well when I acquired an Ace tester.

[CB57]

Got out my scale, and weight varies 60+ grains, too. These are arrows I assembled from shafting. Also have beautiful professionally made 67-70# arrows, too. Yes, these were Strongly recommended for the 58# bow by the maker(!). Those will go up for sale while I look for some better suited arrows.
Don't have time to make my own right now.

[steve b.]

I'm a little confused by your actual dilemma.  Are you having flight problems with both bows that you mentioned?  Or....?   In general, the more center shot the bow the more forgiving your bow is on arrow spine variances.  But there's a difference between arrow flight problems and arrows not shooting where you are looking.  If the arrows fly true then that says alot.  If they all fly true but all hit to the left or right....that's an entirely different problem.
If you want to sell your heavy spined  arrows, PM me.

[CB57]

Tried sending this twice from phone. something not happening, so here, once again, is the rub.
 Arrows bought for the 58# longbow were 67-70# spine. Seller (highly respected, reputable company) insisted I needed heavier spine than the AMO weight because I draw 29" and "125 gr points are heavy enough to require an extra 5+ pounds spine."
All the info I read suggests err on the side of heavier spine. They shoot consistently left at all distances.
Now, the previous arrows I had for the 58# bow (have a half dozen left) turn out to vary 10# in spine and 60 gr in weight! They were close to the suggested spine limits for my nearly center shot sinew backed, but now I don't know what I should do from here. The 58# bow is getting to be too much bow for me (shoulder issues), and want to shoot the lower weight bow, but need correct arrows. Have also started a hickory board bow that I would like to finish around 40#, but will again need to choose correct arrow spine.
Watching other archers shoot, and asking their setups, has left me even more suspicious of advice I've received. Frustrated.

[DC]

I made a six test arrows, each 5# heavier that than the last. Bare shaft, so it's not that much work. Same weight tip on all six. Shoot them and see which is best.

[steve b.]

I agree that the heavier spined arrows should work with the 58.  The bow should just not be that finicky about arrows being slightly high.  I shoot two bows through the summer, getting ready for hunting season.  One is a Hill style glass and boo, maybe an inch wide, too-heavy-for-me, that I use to build up strength.   And an osage flatbow that I shoot off the hand and is 10 lbs. lighter.  I shoot the same wood arrows from both and they both go where I'm aiming.  The heavier bow usually flings the arrows a foot or two higher than the other at 35 yds. 
But I have switched from recurves to flatbows and have had to adjust my windage a good foot or two between the two, one being more center shot than the other.  As the arrows become more mis-spined for the bow they will be harder to make them fly true without a perfect release.  And yes they will group left or right but usually not without some flight problems along the way. 
So if your arrows fly well but group to the side then you just have to change your aiming.  Of course get some lower spined arrows, even a couple, and see what happens with the point of impact just to make sure.