ABO techniques, processes and tools.

[iowabow]

Ben, I'm curious to know what technique you use to get to put  6 pictures up when everyone else is stuck a 4 Bob

me too

[le0n]

^^ he has a photobucket account.

click on one of his images and you'll see how easy it is. once the photobucket page loads, click on the "IMG" text area on the right. it will copy the code to your clipboard. now "paste" it into your reply area on PA where you want the photo to be.

it will put the code in your reply area that looks like this:

Code: [Select]

[URL=http://s677.photobucket.com/user/benjamineble/media/Holy%20Grail%20Outre%20Passe/test%2017/h.jpg.html][IMG]http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv135/benjamineble/Holy%20Grail%20Outre%20Passe/test%2017/h.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
do as many as you want.

of course you'll have to set up an account on photobucket to upload your own images to

[Outbackbob48]

Leon, when I hit attachments it says Restictions 4 per post, what difference would it be wether I have photo bucket or someother acct. I am not real computer savy but 4 seems to me to mean 4. Just saying Bob

[le0n]

^^ the forum application that PA uses doesn't consider it an attachment; because it's not.

it is very smart for there to be a limitation on the amount of "attachments" you can use in a single post because these "attachments" tax the web server and can slow down the PA forum. to compensate for this, the website owner would have to pay for more drive storage and more bandwidth too keep up with the storage and bandwidth demands.

now if you use Photobucket, it's merely a link to a different file server outside of PA. therefore it is not stored on PA's server space nor does it use PA's bandwidth to display the images. it's actually easier on the PA server because all of the work to display the images will be done by Photobucket and your browser. so you can use as many as you'd like.

some forums don't allow "attachments" and force you to use services like, Photobucket, TinyPic, Google+, etc.

on the flip side, some sites don't allow you to 'link' to images located on their server because it can cost them additional money.

oops, didn't mean for that explanation to be that lengthy.

[caveman2533]

Bob,
He is not using the attachments. He is just copying and pasting the IMG address into the text.

[Hummingbird Point]

Ben,

So I'll tell you the brief history of eastern quartzite knapping, as i know it.  A few decades ago some academic knappers/archaeologists who were good flint knappers were trying to figure out quartzite knapping based on what they were seeing in the artifacts and work sites in Virginia and New Jersey. They could see that the overall model was the same as with other lithic resources, where fairly large, fairly thin, flat bifaces were being produced at the rock sources, but they couldn't consistently match the results.  Hammer stones were fine for spalling and some early work but absolutely sucked beyond that.  Antler worked somewhat, some of the time, but that elevator clearly wasn't going all the way to the top.  Probably based on the earlier work in Europe with boxwood billets, someone decided to try hitting the quartzite with wood.  It worked.  For reasons I don't understand, wood it able to consistently drive the long thinning flakes across a piece of average eastern quartzite in a way that other materials can't, to produce flat, relatively thin bifaces.

Now if I am understanding your thought process correctly, you would say that since no white men ever saw any Native Americans using wood percussion knapping tools, and since no such tools have been found by archaeologists, that method of knapping quartzite is invalid, wasn't used, isn't "abo".  Is that correct?

So fast forward to a few years ago and a knapper in the Blue Ridge Mountains was looking at quartzite artifacts and work sites and trying to figure out how the hell they worked this stuff.  He finds the old research, because it was made public, and tries it.  It works.  He puts the idea on Paleo Planet and the thread explodes, going to over 20 pages, with at least another 20 on side topics relating to quartzite knapping.  So a few years later and guys up and down the east coast are working quartzite with wood and getting the same results.  But no white guys ever wrote down that that is the Indian way, and where are the tools, so sorry guys, wrong, not "abo"?

So the knapper mentioned above is Pete Davis.  I feel I owe a real debt to Pete.  I mean if he called me up right now and said he needed help hiding a body I would actually give serious consideration to saying yes, and I'm a real Boy Scout (literally).  See the thing is, I got into knapping after a neighbor showed me an "arrow head" he found.  It was made of quartzite and I was determined to figure out how it could of been made.  I got pretty far at figuring out knapping in general, but quartzite knapping still evaded me.  So Pete putting that information out there and getting the dialogue going helped me find that "holy grail" of knapping I was looking for.

So you mentioned fluting with your method.  As soon as I saw the results you were getting, I was already thinking about it's application to fluting.  When you mentioned that the technique involves pulling instead of pushing the flake off, it immediately struck a chord with me because I have been thinking along the same lines but can't figure out how to do it.  I'm stumbling around a dark room bumping into stuff.  Can you help with the light switch?

Keith

[Outbackbob48]

Thanks leOn and Steve for the simple explanation. Computer stuff is like looking into a deep black hole,there is just nothing that I can see, no sides no bottom just nothing Bob

[nclonghunter]

Keith, I missed the post about "pulling instead of pushing a flake off". If you got post a link to that post I would appreciate it.

If I ever see Pete and You looking at me funny I will be scared..lol

Thanks

[caveman2533]

Keith,
 I think the most important aspect of all the wood billet swinging is the fact that the results we are getting perfectly match the results they were getting, I.E platform and flake morphology.  Nothing will consistently make those platform remnants like wood will.  Yes you will occasionally get a lipped flake using other means but not on a consistent basis like with wood.
This is the point I have been trying to  make to Ben for a long time now. If you take a look at the very rounded and bulbous flake scars/platform initiations he is producing, it is very unique, and it must be matched to the archaeological record to be able to say this is likely what they were doing.  I have not seen him able to do that. That is all I have been meaning when I say "prove it".  If this method was so prevalent then the flakes/bulbs he is making  should be every where.

[mullet]

Caveman, that's why I posted a long time ago to go back and look at some of James Parker's post. He has been doing the same thing with wood billets since the first time I met him.

[Zuma]

Ben,

So I'll tell you the brief history of eastern quartzite knapping, as i know it.  A few decades ago some academic knappers/archaeologists who were good flint knappers were trying to figure out quartzite knapping based on what they were seeing in the artifacts and work sites in Virginia and New Jersey. They could see that the overall model was the same as with other lithic resources, where fairly large, fairly thin, flat bifaces were being produced at the rock sources, but they couldn't consistently match the results.  Hammer stones were fine for spalling and some early work but absolutely sucked beyond that.  Antler worked somewhat, some of the time, but that elevator clearly wasn't going all the way to the top.  Probably based on the earlier work in Europe with boxwood billets, someone decided to try hitting the quartzite with wood.  It worked.  For reasons I don't understand, wood it able to consistently drive the long thinning flakes across a piece of average eastern quartzite in a way that other materials can't, to produce flat, relatively thin bifaces.

Now if I am understanding your thought process correctly, you would say that since no white men ever saw any Native Americans using wood percussion knapping tools, and since no such tools have been found by archaeologists, that method of knapping quartzite is invalid, wasn't used, isn't "abo".  Is that correct?

So fast forward to a few years ago and a knapper in the Blue Ridge Mountains was looking at quartzite artifacts and work sites and trying to figure out how the hell they worked this stuff.  He finds the old research, because it was made public, and tries it.  It works.  He puts the idea on Paleo Planet and the thread explodes, going to over 20 pages, with at least another 20 on side topics relating to quartzite knapping.  So a few years later and guys up and down the east coast are working quartzite with wood and getting the same results.  But no white guys ever wrote down that that is the Indian way, and where are the tools, so sorry guys, wrong, not "abo"?

So the knapper mentioned above is Pete Davis.  I feel I owe a real debt to Pete.  I mean if he called me up right now and said he needed help hiding a body I would actually give serious consideration to saying yes, and I'm a real Boy Scout (literally).  See the thing is, I got into knapping after a neighbor showed me an "arrow head" he found.  It was made of quartzite and I was determined to figure out how it could of been made.  I got pretty far at figuring out knapping in general, but quartzite knapping still evaded me.  So Pete putting that information out there and getting the dialogue going helped me find that "holy grail" of knapping I was looking for.

So you mentioned fluting with your method.  As soon as I saw the results you were getting, I was already thinking about it's application to fluting.  When you mentioned that the technique involves pulling instead of pushing the flake off, it immediately struck a chord with me because I have been thinking along the same lines but can't figure out how to do it.  I'm stumbling around a dark room bumping into stuff.  Can you help with the light switch?

Keith

What ever happened to "Shut-up and knapp"

[iowabow]

Ben,

So I'll tell you the brief history of eastern quartzite knapping, as i know it.  A few decades ago some academic knappers/archaeologists who were good flint knappers were trying to figure out quartzite knapping based on what they were seeing in the artifacts and work sites in Virginia and New Jersey. They could see that the overall model was the same as with other lithic resources, where fairly large, fairly thin, flat bifaces were being produced at the rock sources, but they couldn't consistently match the results.  Hammer stones were fine for spalling and some early work but absolutely sucked beyond that.  Antler worked somewhat, some of the time, but that elevator clearly wasn't going all the way to the top.  Probably based on the earlier work in Europe with boxwood billets, someone decided to try hitting the quartzite with wood.  It worked.  For reasons I don't understand, wood it able to consistently drive the long thinning flakes across a piece of average eastern quartzite in a way that other materials can't, to produce flat, relatively thin bifaces.

Now if I am understanding your thought process correctly, you would say that since no white men ever saw any Native Americans using wood percussion knapping tools, and since no such tools have been found by archaeologists, that method of knapping quartzite is invalid, wasn't used, isn't "abo".  Is that correct?

So fast forward to a few years ago and a knapper in the Blue Ridge Mountains was looking at quartzite artifacts and work sites and trying to figure out how the hell they worked this stuff.  He finds the old research, because it was made public, and tries it.  It works.  He puts the idea on Paleo Planet and the thread explodes, going to over 20 pages, with at least another 20 on side topics relating to quartzite knapping.  So a few years later and guys up and down the east coast are working quartzite with wood and getting the same results.  But no white guys ever wrote down that that is the Indian way, and where are the tools, so sorry guys, wrong, not "abo"?

So the knapper mentioned above is Pete Davis.  I feel I owe a real debt to Pete.  I mean if he called me up right now and said he needed help hiding a body I would actually give serious consideration to saying yes, and I'm a real Boy Scout (literally).  See the thing is, I got into knapping after a neighbor showed me an "arrow head" he found.  It was made of quartzite and I was determined to figure out how it could of been made.  I got pretty far at figuring out knapping in general, but quartzite knapping still evaded me.  So Pete putting that information out there and getting the dialogue going helped me find that "holy grail" of knapping I was looking for.

So you mentioned fluting with your method.  As soon as I saw the results you were getting, I was already thinking about it's application to fluting.  When you mentioned that the technique involves pulling instead of pushing the flake off, it immediately struck a chord with me because I have been thinking along the same lines but can't figure out how to do it.  I'm stumbling around a dark room bumping into stuff.  Can you help with the light switch?

Keith

What ever happened to "Shut-up and knapp"

I am not ok with this kind of exchange on PA. As a long time members I have always been impressed by the respect for others that this community has insisted upon. I just want to caution everyone to consider the image we project. I guess what I am trying to say to everyone is look to the older folks on this site and follow their lead with a goal of helping and sharing. lord knows I have learned a lot from them ...

[Zuma]

Let's be clear Iowa,
Not that I disagree with you.
Are you talking about someone that posts a thread
"Shut up and knap' or someone that responds to it?

It seems like I am getting a lot of flack lately.
From folks that comment when they don't read
the threads/just cherry pick partial parts of it
to make their rather brash comments about.
I have been respectful and aware of the rules.
I get what you mean so I don't think it is to much
 to ask for clarification.
Also --Do you think your threads are general knapping
or more like tutorials?
Thanks Zuma

[iowabow]

Hey Zuma thanks you for the way you replied. I am really speaking in general terms in hopes that thing don't spin out of control. I am addressing the greater context that brought us to "this". I myself have been guilty of "this" in the past and learned a lot from some of the long time members here. I tried to be careful to address my comments to the community by not focusing on you or any others individually. My post was to ask everyone to think about the positive in our PA community and use that as a compass that guides the way we treat each other. 

Do you think your post are general knapping or tutorials?
The answer is yes in that that are sometimes instructive and at times are more like a general thread.

[Zuma]

And thank you.
I agree 100 percent. Sometimes we forget that our
passions are not shared by all. I had hoped to avoid
this way back as you know. I think respectful clarification
is a good tool.
You all may not know this but Keith and I have great discussions
when ever we get together. I think of him as a friend and was
just bustin him a bit. I think twice from now on, for the common
good. If you remember he posted about me doing the Hokey Pokey
while knapping. I thought it was funny.
Zuma