sinew question

[Spotted Dog]

 I have a large amount of elk leg sinew pounded and stripped apart. Now I have heard of washing it out with soap.
That doesn't make since to me to wash out the natural elements in it. Also combing out. Now do any of you all do
this ? Combing I can understand but why ?  Getting ready to back my first bow in the morning. Any help I'd be
very grateful.

[PEARL DRUMS]

Check out my sinew backed hackberry static in the build alongs. Lots of pics for you to see. I never wash bows or sinew, never have and wont. Lots of fellas do.

[Spotted Dog]

I will check it out.

[Redhand]

I don't wash the sinew from legs, they are pretty clean meaning no fat on the sinew.  Sometimes if you are using back strap sinew there might be fat remaining on the sinew depending how well you scraped it when putting it up to dry.  As far as combing I usually comb out my sinew before applying to the bow. 

[Pat B]

I wash sinew and bows before combining the two. If I'm going to the trouble of sinew backing a bow I want it right the first time. I've had the sinew lit off of 3 bows. Since then I've washed the sinew and the bows back with Dawn dish soap. I rinse the sinew in warm water and the bow with boiling water. I haven't had a lift off since.
 I would not wash the sinew now but store it dry.

[JW_Halverson]

Fats and greases are perfectly natural.  No argument there.  But fats and greases are also a barrier preventing the hide glue (another natural component) from binding mechanically to wood (yet another natural component).

If you have even a hint of grease in the sinew, naturally, it will not bind as well as it is capable of.  Using wood ash and water creates a weak lye solution that will react with fat to turn it into a natural soap that can be rinsed out.  That's about as natural as it gets. All soaps are a variation on that theme, so in a sense, that is all natural, too. 

In bowmaking, it is all about tradeoffs.  You trade off speed for long term reliability, width versus depth, this versus that, etc.  This is just another thing you have to balance for yourself.  How risk averse are you to having your bow fail by the sinew delaminating?  If it would bother you to put in loads of hours of work and the time/cost of materials just to have it turn into junk at the wrong moment, then trade a little time with Dawn dishwashing liquid wash job on the sinew. 

[Spotted Dog]

I have a stupid question based on my first one.
Mike Yancey and Ed Scott both use TBIII. Is there any problem with that ? I have never used hide glue.
I have Mike's dvd and have watched it closely.

[Pat B]

I don't think you will get the full potential from the sinew when using TBIII. Many have used it and like it. I have only use TBIII to seal a sinew back but not for applying sinew.

[JW_Halverson]

Like hide glue, the TBIII sets up before the sinew dries.  However, unlike hide glue, the TBIII does not allow the sinew to shorten as it cures.  Because of this it does not allow the sinew to add reflex to the bow as it cures.

Yes, it works.  But it is like running bad gas in a racing engine.  Your cylinders go up and down and the wheels go roundy round....just not at full potential. 

If you are making the effort to sinew the bow, there is no difference in the amount of work necessary to use hide glue as it is to use TBIII.  Whichever route you take, it is messy, sticky, and you better come equipped with a sense of humor when you do it.  I would rather get the full effect by using the hide glue.

Ok, now ask your stupid question. The one you asked was a good one. 

[lebhuntfish]

I do it just like PatB suggest and it works awesome! I won't do it any other way. Check out "gidget gets her sinew"  in the how to and build along section that Pat done.

On the other hand, I done my first one with tight bond 2. Let me put it this way, it worked...   But I promise I will never do that again. I may be wrong but I think Ed Scott uses tight bond liquid hide glue. But I've seen bad results with that to.  Just get you some unflavored Knox gelatin. Put 3 packs in a 1/3 cup of water and let them sit for about 45 min. Then transfer that to a double boiler. (i use a small crock pot with water in it with a metal bowl floating on top) let the mixture "melt"  if it's too hot to put your fingers in its too hot for the sinew. Patrick

[Spotted Dog]

Well I did it and it looks like poop right now. I tried to comb it smooth but like combing a goats behind.
Wait and see......... I guess.

[PEARL DRUMS]

TB sucks for sinew, shoulda' asked! Hide glue or Knox is all you need.

As far as what Ed uses, you have to look at his bows and consider their design. Like Yancey they are packed with glue, sawdust and some sinew, rasped smooth and shaped after they dry hard and then covered in rawhide AND skins. When you add that much "stuff" to a bow limb the glue you use is insignificant.

[Pappy]

not putting them guys down by any means, but what Pearl said. :)on all counts in his last post.
 Pappy

[PEARL DRUMS]

Exactly, no knocking of anybody. Just pointing out why and how it can and cant work with sinew.

[Spotted Dog]

Well this was my first try. We will see. Next time I will do it the other way.
I hope this works. If not I learned something either way.
Thank you for your help.