some questions about western juniper

[Blacktail]

i went out with the family last week end to cut some juniper..i cut one tree about 5-7 and a few branches...for some reason i was thinking the tree would have more heart wood than what i was finding..it was mostly sap wood and a small heart..SO,are branchs better AND can a bow be made out of just sap wood (with sinew backing)...for bow making i am looking at making shorter bows and wider limbs....my family and i are looking at staying here in central oregon for a long period and i am wanting too learn more about juniper and since it grows by the truck load here why not...thanks john

[bowsandroses]

Hey John how are you doing! The bows that I've made out of juniper heart wood have all failed during tiller,violently. The bows I've built out of mostly and all sap wood have been fast and resiliant shooters. My sons 50# bow will out cast my 75# osage I built in John Strunks 2001 class. The heart wood seems to me that it has fair compression value and no tension value. I have a couple staves I hope to work out this winter let me know how it works out for you, I'm interested in your opinion of Juniper. Oh and I definately vote for limbs as the trunk seems to have a looser fiber. Though the first one I built was from a trunk I called my bowstill , long story. It was all white wood and the grain was turned side ways ran from belly to back with no backing and drew 50% of it's length. I clearly had no idea what I was doing, I chalk that one up to crap house luck.   Hugh.

[loefflerchuck]

John, most old bows were all sapwood. They were split off a large living tree. I have not really noticed a difference between all heartwood and all sapwood or a mix of both. A problem that can arise when you only have a little heartwood on the belly is sometimes it will lift away from the sapwood when shooting. I most like to use the wood right under the bark. Degrease it and rough it up and put some sinew on it.

[Keenan]

John, Most all my juniper bows have been made from the top side of Juniper branches. Most of the Natives of this area used the top sides of branches as well for good reason. The top side of the branch grows under tension and is therefor the strongest for tension. Also the top of the branch has tighter rings and the heart is always closer to the surface for a better balance of Sap/heartwood  ratio.  I agree heartwood is brittle and not good for tension and the sap is much better. At the same time heartwood seems a little better for compression then the sap and in my experience yields a better bow then all sapwood. Not arguing or saying that all sapwood bow isn't good just saying the few all sapwood juniper bows that I have made did not perform as well. If you want to go out and cut some I would welcome the company and take you to some favorite spots. Need to build up my inventory anyway.
 This pic is of one I cut several years ago and made a great trade bow out of it. If fact I think you came over and felt that one strung up.

[bowsandroses]

   Keenan no argument taken by me if you were refering to me. Rather the opinion is always apriciated by me (he who needs all the help he can get) 

[Keenan]

Bowsandroses, I feel the same way. Could be the way I built the previous sapwood bows. Seems the wood is generally not to blame just the person trying to read it in my case, LOL    I do better when I don't try to tell the wood what to do and just try to figure out what it wants to be

[bowsandroses]

Ha Ha! Great points But I'm Scott, German, Irish and Welsh It's my nature to argue with any fence post

[Blacktail]

there is some great info on here..thanks Hugh,Chuck,Keenan for your input...it sound like i could learn a whole lot more about this wood..and i cant wait...Keenan,in the pics you shared..IS that a branch..i told Nikki it looks like a tree and seeing how much heart wood there was it blew me away....thanks again...KEENAN,are you busy this Saturday..john

[loefflerchuck]

What Keenan said. I feel like I have been paying more attention to amounts of sinew on different designs and for a minute forgot, the top of the limb or the side of the trunk facing away from the river if I remember that right.

[Keenan]

Yes John that "was" a branch  tis now a bow! Saterday may work for me. Opening weekend for the late hunt but Lulyn is working and it's looking like rain/snow in the valley so may stay close to home

[Blacktail]

sounds great...how will i know for sure and what would be a good time to come over.....will you have wade...i to get too work ...john

[Blacktail]

hmmmm.

[Keenan]

Hi John sorry for not getting back to you yet. Yesterday was very packed schedule. Give me a call tonight and we can work out the plans

[Blacktail]

its o.k. i put the hmmmm on so you wouldnt forget...i will call tonight...

[Newindian]

Some of the juniper branches around here will get only a paper thin layer of sapwood on the upper side though