Making an Eastern Red Cedar stave

[owensww]

I am looking for advice on choosing an eastern red cedar tree and seasoning the wood.

Marc St. Louis was kind enough to provide me with specs to build an unbacked ERC ELB pulling 35# at 25" so that my wife can shoot it. He suggested making it 67" in length with the middle third measuring 1 1/4" in width and then tapering to 1/2" at the tips. Thickness at the center would be 3/4" tapering to 1/2". He recommended using 1/4" sapwood on the back for it's elastic qualities and heartwood on the belly for it's relative compressive strength and using a D-cross section. Since SC is humid, hopefully that will give me the edge to make a functional bow versus an impromptu fireworks display.

I have previously made board bows and need advice on ERC tree selection and stave preparation.

Given how long it takes for Eastern red cedar to grow, I would like to minimize the carnage and pick a tree with good potential. What is the smallest diameter tree that would likely yield a stave with adequate sap and heartwood for the intended dimensions above and not have too much crown?

How essential is it for the usable portion of the tree to be free of limbs?

When you season ERC what preparation method yield the least amount of splitting while preventing excessive warping? I've read about people leaving the wood whole and painting the ends, splitting or sawing in half or quarters, and even roughing it out green, all with mixed advantages and disadvantages.  Any personal experience?

Would there be any advantage in using a strong finish on the back, something like an epoxy, to prevent raised splinters? What about Boning?

I appreciate your advice.

Thank you,

Wyndham

[Pat B]

Try to find a cedar tree with very few limbs.        Maybe in a multi-trunk tree or a tree in heavy cover. Anything 2" in diameter or over will make the bow you want to make. If it has knots in the back I'd back the bow with rawhide.
A few years ago I saw an all sapwood ERC bow that pulled 45#@28" and was a great shooting bow. That can be another option.

[Pappy]

Have your wife wear head gear Just kidding but they do blow violently.
The only one I had to hold un backed was mostly sap wood,it was a nice shooter. Like Pat said ,try and find one as clean as possible and with as even
sap wood as you can find.  I would leave the sap wood as the back and just lightly scrap off the bark,kind of like you would do Yew at least that's my plan on my next ERC. Got some seasoned just need to get motivated. 
   Pappy

[blackhawk]

try to find one at least more than 6" in diameter if you want heartwood in the bow. If its a fast growing tree it can have really thick sapwood n maybe not enough heartwood if you cut a smaller tree. But ya won't know till you cut one down. And a larger diameter will tend to have less pin knots as well.

Pat n pappy gave ya good advice,and ill say it as well cus its important with erc(most the time). Find one that's really clean with no limbs and knots and straight. Sometimes you'll find this where it grows in a thick understory and must shoot up straight n clean,and also look especially for trunks that are growing hard against another(as there will be no limb or knots there). It might take ya awhile and ya might look at over 50 trees before ya find on with a clean enough section/sections in it for a bow.

[beetlebailey1977]

I have cut quite a good bit of ERC and I live in South Carolina.  As far a tree to choose....the best one are multiple trunk trees with the inner sides or a trunk completely concealed in the tree out of the sunlight.  These will usually be clear and have no limbs.  I cut and immediately seal the ends of the trunks then split into whatever size I can get.  If it is during the growing season I have found it is best to peel the bark off and seal the back.  Although I have peeled the back and not sealed it and have not had a problem with that.  Just keep them out the sun or the wind if you peel the back.  With our high humidity it will not dry to fast.  The reason I peel the back is the powder post beetles really eat up and bore into the sap wood bad.  In the winter I leave the bark on and try to spray the wood real well.  I try to let the wood season as long as possible.  I have some that is 4 years old.

[owensww]

Thank you for your responses. I definitely have a better feel know for what I am looking for

[owensww]

I found a cedar, a nice limbless one that had been growing in the understory. It was about 4 inches in diameter and had a good heartwood ratio when I cut it. It has very thin growth rings and is at least 50 years old. I sealed the ends and split it. Along the 8-9 foot length it literally has a propeller twist of 180 degrees. If shortened to appropriate stave length it still will be atleast 90 degrees.

From what I've read ERC doesn't tolerate much heat treating or steaming . With that much twist is it even worth trying a selfbow? Would side nocks help at all?

Is the propeller twist an inherent growth pattern of the particular tree I picked or is it ever an error of splitting technique?

Thanks guys,

W

[turtle]

I have not worked with erc yet so i cant tel you anything about how well it tolerates heating or steaming, but the twist is how the wood grew not a splitting error. I always carefuly study the bark of a tree i am thinking of harvesting to see if the grain of the bark twists around the trunk. Some trees its harder to tell than others, but some trees its plainly visable. I have left a lot of trees stand just because they had more twist than i wanted to deal with. Just something to watch for in the future when looking for stave trees.

[Onebowonder]

If you build a billet bow or a take-down, you would likely find lengths enough that don't spin too quick.  You might even be able to do something creative where matching twists could be set into the bow such that they work together to allow the string to pass to the side of arrow shelf.

[Ben M]

There's a guy over on the Tradbow forum who killed a buck with an ERC self bow a few weeks ago. He gave quite a few details about the bow, might be worth a look for you.

http://www.tradbow.com/members/cfmbb/messages.cfm?threadid=DE63BF69-1422-1DE9-EDD29D1C967BBFCF