Need your opinion, ...discussion welcome, + glue question + profile

[Marc St Louis]

I would use the longer one and cut 2" from each end

[PatM]

If you are only going to use TB to glue the sinew and leave the bow long there really isn't much point to using sinew. You might as well use rawhide. That's  more or less what sinew mixed with TB ends up as.
 Even if you don't care for true short bows, at least shorten to the point where you are using materials to their full advantage and apply them in a way that plays to their strengths.
  A happy medium would be  56-58 inches with knox or hide glue holding the sinew on and drawing the bow to the point where the sinew is working rather than providing insurance. You can waterproof it somehow, even if it means a modern finish.
 Pat

[NOMADIC PIRATE]

So using TB III for sinewing doesn't make the sinew work like sinew ??


You are saying that if I reflex the bow and recurve the tips I will get the same set as if I'd left the bow unbacked of sinew ??


D TILLER,, I think 58" is the shortest I'll ever go not very keen on short bows, and didn't find any advantages in the jungle, only shooting ability disadvantages

[Jbell]

From my experience, which isn't that much, I would not use TB. I used it once on a sinewed bow and didn't get the results I wanted.It did not pull any reflex and felt real mushy when drawn and trust me It was plenty cured, a pretty crappy performer. If you are worried about moisture my suggestion would be to lay down 3 courses with Knox or hide glue, then when fully cured size the back with a thin coat of tb3 or if using a skin of some sort use tb3, but keep it thin or It may actually lock in moisture instead of keeping it out. What kind of finish are you going to use, Parrifin?  I would Imagine that It would work pretty well on sinew since It keeps the moisture out of your selfbows in your humid climate. Good luck with whatever you do. Just my 2 cents.

[NOMADIC PIRATE]

How about the TB liquid hide glue ?...I was planning to finish this one with spar urathane

[PatM]

Apparently Liquid hide glue works OK if it is  a fresh batch(hard to tell) and dried well and then sealed. Using regular TB will just make your sinew inert rather than retaining elastic properties. It would be like installing shocks and encasing them in concrete.
 Pat

[Justin Snyder]

Liquid hide glue is basically the same as hot hide glue. They add a salt solution to it to decrease the melting point. This makes it stay liquid and slightly weaker than the regular stuff.  Justin

[NOMADIC PIRATE]

O.K., Knox/hide glues are what I'm leaning towards,.....for now

[D. Tiller]

I'm trying an experiment right now with TB II and sinew. I'm of the opinion that the problem is that TBII does not penitrate the sinew well and let it relax. What I'm doing is pre-wetting the sinew in water untill it relaxes then wringing out the sinew and then dipping it in TBII before aplying it to the bow. I also wrapped the bow in siranwrap to slow down the drying and give the glue a chance to dry at the same speed as the glue. I will keep you posted on what happens!

David Tiller

[NOMADIC PIRATE]

Interesting, I'm definatly curious to know what you think

[NOMADIC PIRATE]

Change of direction , just got some words of a bowyer that uses TB III for sinewing his bows and gets excellent results,.....guess I'm back leaning into the TB III option

[Marc St Louis]

Regardless of what some people might say you won't get the same results with TB3 as you would with hide glue but it will work ok as long as you introduce some reflex before you apply the sinew. Even though the sinew is encased with TB3 it will still be affected by moisture and consequently lose cast. You will basically get the same moisture proofing with hide glue if you use a good finish and maintain it, the key word here is "good" finish.

[Coo-wah-chobee]

                  With Marc on this....bob

[Justin Snyder]

I'm with Bob and Marc on this one.  I have been doing a lot of reading about animal glues, and here is my thinking.  Because hide glue gels before it dries, if forms one continuous layer with the sinew.  As tight bond dries, it will honeycomb, leaving tiny pockets of air in the glue. When the hide glue is put under stress it will stretch because it is one continuous piece with sinew reinforcing.  The TB will be hundreds of individual pieces of sinew kind of linked with glue.  The other benefit of hide glue is that it glues when it gels.  This means you don't need to hold it in place as long as synthetics. Because it is gelled, not dry, the last piece will stick with the same strength as the first. You could wait until the TB is tacky, but that means partially dry, and the next piece will not stick to it with the same strength.  When an additional layer of sinew is added, the hide glue actually reconstitutes, and the new sinew becomes part of the original layer, not a new layer.  Do not use the liquid hide glue.  It gives away one of the great benefits of hide glue of gluing when it gels. I thought it might help make the decision easier, or harder, but more informed.  Justin

[NOMADIC PIRATE]

Hmmm, leaning towards hide/knox .....again