Author Topic: History Channel - Warriors  (Read 45455 times)

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Yewboy

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Re: History Channel - Warriors
« Reply #75 on: April 30, 2009, 08:07:59 pm »
More in agreement than you might expect Nick, but like any other rational being, not about to give up observation and understanding for blind and unquestioning admiration any time soon...

And you must admit that some of the "explanations" on offer only serve to confuse or cast doubt.

For example:
A "slashing loose" is just that. It is not a contrived method of pre-aiming and drawing, but it can be the fast and fluent loosing component in more than one style of draw.

Rod.

Oh of course that's it, I just remembered you know and I don't. Silly me!




nick1346

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Re: History Channel - Warriors
« Reply #76 on: May 02, 2009, 06:26:40 pm »

Nick: maybe we could film some looses at Batsford with my high speed camera then see what info we can deduce from these?

it should be possible to tell the arrow speed and the archers speed and thus what amount of this arrow speed is due to the active loose
we could also film the same archer not using an active loose and compare them in great detail


Sounds liike a good idea Alan, I'll be there with cameras in hand but I've got to film something first else as a priority ;)

Rod

  • Guest
Re: History Channel - Warriors
« Reply #77 on: May 05, 2009, 10:23:05 am »
That would be both interesting and informative since it would allow everyone to see how the whole thing comes together.

What interests me is how the sequence is co-ordinated by different folks and how that effects the shot.
My personal view remains that timing, good extension and a clean loose will characterise the good shots.

And that a breakdown in timing, a lack of extension and a less than slick loose will characterise the poor shots.

It might be useful to have some sort of point of reference in shot behind the archer, such as a vertical pole so as to better perceive and compare the relative movement of the parts.

Also to see the loose and arrow departure from behind might prove instructive.

Rod.

Rod

  • Guest
Re: History Channel - Warriors
« Reply #78 on: May 07, 2009, 01:23:48 pm »
More in agreement than you might expect Nick, but like any other rational being, not about to give up observation and understanding for blind and unquestioning admiration any time soon...

And you must admit that some of the "explanations" on offer only serve to confuse or cast doubt.

For example:
A "slashing loose" is just that. It is not a contrived method of pre-aiming and drawing, but it can be the fast and fluent loosing component in more than one style of draw.

Rod.

Oh of course that's it, I just remembered you know and I don't. Silly me!





Yewboy
You can do better than that.

The point is that the style of loose is not, except in a limited context, predetermined by the style of the draw.

There are of course, more common and less common combinations.

So it would be appreciated if you could refrain from the weak sarcasm and consider what it is that you have to say and then say it succinctly and politely.

It seems to me that the heavy draw for shooting distance is so alike to a normal ground up draw and loose that the only distiguishing features to an observer, signs of greater effort aside, are the "push" with the body into the loose and the degree of reaction to loosing the weight.

In my somewhat limited experience it seems to me that it is more in the timing and the fluency than in the more obvious reaction.

Also, as a general rule, that the better the archer, the less apparent the effort.
Obviously being mindful that mastering their draw weight in these bows is a work in progress for most.

FWIW

Rod.

Offline alanesq

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Re: History Channel - Warriors
« Reply #79 on: May 07, 2009, 02:23:04 pm »

I am sure you are right that most of it is technique
- I know this as I have yet to get a decent technique myself ;-)

the question I want to try and answer is what is the difference in distances between a perfect "standard" loose and the same perfect loose but also trying to throw the bow forward as the arrow leaves to give a bit more power

The question for me is; is the effort of doing an active loose worth doing
    i.e. will the arrow go another 10 yards or 10mm?

Rod

  • Guest
Re: History Channel - Warriors
« Reply #80 on: May 15, 2009, 12:03:29 pm »
From my own observations and practice, I would say that what distinguishes a loose for maximising distance from one that maximises accuracy is a fast tempo and a more dynamic action through the extension and loose.

Shooting for accuracy there is a benefit in producing the same cast every time, making the shot more predictable.
Here there is a likely advantage in the tempo being consistent with the extension and loose measured.

For greatest distance it is probably advantageous to have a faster tempo and a fluent uninterrupted extension.

But both methods benefit from a clean and fluent in-line active loose.

When the final extension is seamlessly co-ordinated with a pushing of the bow, a more dynamic loose is attainable, but it is still important to have a clean non-disruptive loose.
Good awareness of shaft length and feeling for the head coming to the hand, control of length and loose is necessary to avoid self linflicted injury with the more fluid style of draw and loose when drawing to the head.

The more common factors in getting poorer distance might be less than full extension in the line of force, a disruptive loose causing untidy arrow departure, a slower tempo and inappropriate balance in a shaft of a given weight and excessive fletch size.

If the draw weight has not pulled the relaxed wrist into the line of force at full draw, the bow is significantly under drawn.

We will see some folks at full draw with wrist bent and elbow cocked up, sometimes stopping briefly at anchor and letting the fingers go forward.
This obviously gives up drawlength and cast due to not extending fully and not maintaining rearward extension through the loose.

The stronger shooters can be observed pushing into the bow as they come into the loose.
Jumping is I think a reaction to this with the heavy draw weights and can be disadvantageous if it involves throwing the bow out of line during the departure of the arrow, such as by casting the arm out of line during the loose or by deliberately jumping in anticipation of the loose.

In terms of practice, I think the first prerequisite is to attain full extension with a direct line of force and a clean active loose that does not disrupt the flight of the arrow.

Then and only then should one work on increasing the tempo and perfecting the co-ordination of pushing into the loose. If full extension is not made and a clean active loose obtained, there will be no advantage in the latter.

Rod.

« Last Edit: May 18, 2009, 11:28:13 am by Rod »