Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Shaneisneato on November 01, 2014, 07:29:32 pm
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So this is my first bow. You guys have been a tremendous resource, I have to especially thank Danzn Bar for the stave. He met up with a while ago and gave me straight as could be Hickory stave. I split it careful as he suggested and have enough left over for a second bow. Bow is roughed out and starting to floor tiller.
(http://i.imgur.com/6zZArjM.jpg)
You can see the extra I had left over above. The bow is 66 inches tall and 2 inches wide.
(http://i.imgur.com/VwsvhCV.jpg)
I had stick the end in my girlfriends boot to get it to stay sideways.
(http://i.imgur.com/l67Q6rr.jpg)
Close up. The end of the limbs are still a little thick.
(http://i.imgur.com/tYayW8O.jpg)
Floor tillering. One end limb is a little stiffer than the other. Seeing a picture from this angle makes me realize how much the out half of the limbs aren't bending.
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so far so good. keep rasping mid limb and out. i like to do a strong floor tiller, so when i look down the limb at the
perfect angle i can see how the limb will look low braced
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I'll starting working on the limbs again tomorrow with the rasp. I think I will also make the handle a little thinner too.
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Looking pretty good to my eyes, I would agree with wizard goat about the floor tiller. Also your fades look a little sharp. You might carefully taper them into the working limb. Witch means you may have to angle them back into your handle some more. Hickory is tuff stuff and will give you a work out with the rasp! Keep us posted can't wait to see the results. Patrick
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It's a good idea to wait and see how things line up at low brace before you narrow your handle, or your tips. Do you have a tiller tree or stick?
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If I were you, I'd rasp the inner limb a little thinner, but keep away from the innermost three inches. Easy on the midlimb, it is the weakest section right now. On the outer limbs, I would make them narrower instead of thinner and see if that does the job. Then brace it, and continue as usual.
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lebhuntfish: The handle is tall enough that there should be enough room to blend the fades into the handle more. I may just do a little of that and hold off on narrowing the handle and tips until I get it on the tillering tree.
Wizardgoat and Jodocus: I think i'm just gonna rasp the limbs a little more and work on blending the fades a little more. I won't narrow anything until I get it up on the tillering tree. I was gonna try and build one today, got most of the stuff already.
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Looking good so far..... that's a piece of pignut hickory, get it to brace as soon as you can and be careful not to let it hinge or it might fret on you. 66" is a good length. :) ;) I'd leave the ends/tips thick (last 6-8") and narrow them side to side , later on once you have the string in the middle of the handle.
Good looking start and keep us posted...
DBar
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Just now getting over being sick for the last week or so. Put the bow up on the tillering tree and pulled it with a long string.
(http://i.imgur.com/fN6g3xv.jpg)
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Looking good...a couple scrapes right where those chains are pointing and you could probably low brace it.
Don
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Watch mid limb to nocks. Looks like that area needs to bend more. Jawge
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Outer thirds need more bend. Outer half maybe. Good start though.
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Thanks for the replies guys. I'll focus on that outer half or so and see if I can get it up to a low brace. I got the string just need learn how to do a flemish twist. I feel like I am taking forever on this first bow. Don't know how some of you guys crank'em out as fast you do. ;D
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Shane,
Looks like the right side is stronger than the left. Hit that side with a few scrapes before you touch the left and see if it evens up some. agree with the other guys mid limb out needs some work on both limbs. Look,n good. How wide is it?
DBar
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Will do, I'll try and even it up. Its 2 inches wide.
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What design are you after?getting the front profile right before tillering is key.i wouldn't go any farther until that is set in place.get the outer limb shaped for the last 12" for sure.good luck!
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Narrowed and shaped up the limbs to a piramid shape from about midlimb to the tip. Now looking at attaching some cedar overlays for the nocks. The back of the bow is rough with the layer or wood that was underneath the bark. Should I put the overlays directly over that or sand it down smooth before gluing the overlays on?
(http://i.imgur.com/Q2qOiQH.jpg)
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If it is visibly rough and stringy, scrape or sand gently to make sure you are really in the wood. Most hickory I have worked with is smooth and medium hard, so it smooths and polishes easily. Stingy stuff makes me thing you have bark residue.
Looking good!
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The wood on the belly and sides is white, smooth and hard so its definitely leftover from the bark. I was given this stave and it was dried like this. I kind of like how it looks, if I scraped/sanded gently through to the first layer of the wood for the overlays and left the rest on the bow would this negatively affect the bow?
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should be fine
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and round off the corners more.
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and round off the corners more.
Planning on it :)
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I wouldn't floor tiller much further if I were you. I don't know it's because I don't make wide limb bows anymore but that thing looks like it's getn pretty thin. I would be switching to a long string or what ever you use when first stringing.
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I wouldn't floor tiller much further if I were you. I don't know it's because I don't make wide limb bows anymore but that thing looks like it's getn pretty thin. I would be switching to a long string or what ever you use when first stringing.
Already been up on the tiller tree with a long string. It looks thin but is pulling a lot of weight as its wide. I'm getting the nocks on it so I can throw the bowstring on, brace it and start final tillering it.
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Shane,
Cedar is a pretty wood to look at .....but IMHO for tip overlays it is too soft of wood. Overlays are to protect the bows back from splitting from the string. Antler , horn or a harder wood would be a better choice. I have some scrap osage pieces you can have if you like....osage gets darker with time and would be a nice looking contrast to hickory....just offering. :-\
You should remove that first layer to add the overlays. That pignut hickory back is a little different than other hickory I've cut. I don't believe it is the cambium layer you seeing. The bows I've made out of the same tree I lightly sanded the back to remove the dark colored ridges. I don't think you have too though.....except under the overlays.
Look'n good so far, that is some exceptional hickory if the RH is low you will be surprise how thin the limbs will be for the weigth....
Good luck and keep us posted..
DBar
Oh let me know on the osage material and I might have some other woods too if your interested.
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Shane,
Cedar is a pretty wood to look at .....but IMHO for tip overlays it is too soft of wood. Overlays are to protect the bows back from splitting from the string. Antler , horn or a harder wood would be a better choice. I have some scrap osage pieces you can have if you like....osage gets darker with time and would be a nice looking contrast to hickory....just offering. :-\
You should remove that first layer to add the overlays. That pignut hickory back is a little different than other hickory I've cut. I don't believe it is the cambium layer you seeing. The bows I've made out of the same tree I lightly sanded the back to remove the dark colored ridges. I don't think you have too though.....except under the overlays.
Look'n good so far, that is some exceptional hickory if the RH is low you will be surprise how thin the limbs will be for the weigth....
Good luck and keep us posted..
DBar
Oh let me know on the osage material and I might have some other woods too if your interested.
Can't thank you enough. :D if you have some scrap wood you wouldn't care to throw my way that would be awesome. I'll see about giving you a call tomorrow.
You are right about this being mighty strong hickory. Everyone keeps telling me how it looks thin but I'm still seeing a lot of weight when its up on the tillering tree.
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(http://i.imgur.com/4Iw9eSy.jpg)
Got the walnut overlays glued on and just need to shape them up. Started doing some of the finishing sanding on the bow, wanting to leave some of the rough darker layer on towards the center of the bow and fade it out to the actual first layer of wood towards the tips as you can see in the picture.
Thanks again to Danzn Bar, he has been awesome and I wouldn't be nearly as as a long if it wasn't for him and you guys as well.
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Hey is there any possible way that you could get me that other billet in your picture. Maybe a trade?
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Shane,
Looking good!, not to be telling you what to do without you asking, but get those tips shaped up, get it braced, and then take it easy on the tillering tree until you get it to about 2-3 inches from full draw and then final tiller with you pulling and pictures taken....
And let's see some more pictures. :D :D ;)
Sorry if it sounds like I'm rushing you, don't mean to, take you time :)
DBar
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haha I'm hurrying best I can. :D
Was hoping to get some work in this weekend but ended up busy all weekend.
Picked up another project this weekend with restoring/modifying a vintage drafting table but I'm gonna try and not let the bow get pushed to the back burner.
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Started shaping and sanding the overlays down. How is it looking guys?
(http://i.imgur.com/73sFJFi.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/KbQ6ZFa.jpg)
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What weight and drawlength are you aiming for? It's key that you have a plan.
Before bracing the bow you should be pulling your intended draw weight on the long string. The long string should also be tight on the belly when in the nocks.
I use the longstring out to 18 - 20 inch because it allows you to get the tiller almost perfect whilst putting the minimum of stress on it (when it will still have weak/stiff spots).
Once i've got to this stage then it's time to brace it.
The first thing to check as soon as you brace it is the strength of the limbs relative to each other. Your lower limb should be a hair stiffer.
If you aren't going over 60# draw weight then I would narrow the 2 inch section to 1 3/4 now and maybe further once i'd got braced and had an eye on how much set it had taken.. Overly wide limbs end up being thinner than necessary and thinner limbs are harder to tiller than thicker limbs. Althought it's not a massive consideration at this point ;) thinner limbs also return slower.....
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(http://i.imgur.com/7tQe0Xn.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/PsiZAoJ.jpg)
Here is the bow at a low brace and on the tree with a long string. How is the tiller looking? The angle of the second picture is not straight on, asked the SO to take the picture while I was pulling...what can you do. ::)
Was wanting to get your all's opinion before I started pulling further with real bow string.
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Bending a lot out of the fades. Mid limb on both sides needs more bend imo. I'm still a newb though so wait for others to chime in
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Bending a lot out of the fades. Mid limb on both sides needs more bend imo. I'm still a newb though so wait for others to chime in
Yep, Now that I'm looking at it in the pictures I see what you are talking about.
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I was thinking same thing about it bending too much out of fades. Mid limb and out. Its looking good though.
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I was thinking same thing about it bending too much out of fades. Mid limb and out. Its looking good though.
So a little scrapping on the mid limbs out? Wish I could put a little back into the area by the fade ???
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Don't sweat it Shane. you aren't done yet. You've done a great job getting a symetrical bend, for one thing.
So, I mess up a lot of bows through enthusiasm, and have some tricks for you.
Grab some masking tape, take a long olook at you last pic and the bow, and wrap some tape around where you don't want any more removal. To my eye, that is about 1/3 of the limb length (starting at the fades, outward). Then work that next third of the limb using a systematic wood removal system. My favorite is where you just scuff it up with the rasp, and then scrape the rasp marks off. Or, I even sometimes get a dark crayon or piece of charcoal and mark areas I want scraped, and then scrape until that is gone.
Your next couple of inches of tip movement should come from that middle third, and the rest should stay put. Then stop and re-evaluate.
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I couldn't tell you how many times I have wished I could put wood back on a piece I was working on. Most of the time it works out just fine though, most of the time.... ;)
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Don't sweat it Shane. you aren't done yet. You've done a great job getting a symetrical bend, for one thing.
So, I mess up a lot of bows through enthusiasm, and have some tricks for you.
Grab some masking tape, take a long olook at you last pic and the bow, and wrap some tape around where you don't want any more removal. To my eye, that is about 1/3 of the limb length (starting at the fades, outward). Then work that next third of the limb using a systematic wood removal system. My favorite is where you just scuff it up with the rasp, and then scrape the rasp marks off. Or, I even sometimes get a dark crayon or piece of charcoal and mark areas I want scraped, and then scrape until that is gone.
Your next couple of inches of tip movement should come from that middle third, and the rest should stay put. Then stop and re-evaluate.
This sounds like a plan. I have some of those lumber crayons that would be perfect for marking.
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Good advice given......wouldn't touch the fade area. yea don't worry about not making weight, takes some bows under your belt to hit your weight. If push comes to shove you could cut it off (pike) a bit.
What does the front profile and un braced profile look like? You will probably have to take some width off of the tips.
Good job, look'n good.
DBar
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Worked on the areas you guys suggested. Hoping its looking better now and I'm about finished :laugh:
(http://i.imgur.com/LoCNOG4.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/QElumVs.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/it93UEy.jpg)
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Yep your about finnished now!
looks so much better don't it?
you have done a fine job
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Looking good. yes the tiller is definitely better. nice work.
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You're almost there with a fantastic first bow! The tiller looks pretty good to my eyes (which aren't :() hence the attached ellipse thing. A pic of the profile you have now would help. Do you shoot with three fingers under the arrow?
Maybe a few scrapes on the outer top limb? Then exercise it and fling some arrows at the draw lenght you're at on the tree to judge how it shoots and to reveal any additional set at any weak areas from the shooting-in. If the bow seems slow or has a lot of handshock, I'd consider narrowing the limbs- albeit with reduced draw weight. The string angle is very good so you be able to get more draw lenght if you want.
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Looking good, a little bit off the upper limb on the outer third and you should be good to go! Take your time while fine tuning! Keep posting pics looks like your getting it walked into place! Patrick
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One last tiller check guys. The more I stare at it the less I can figure if it needs anything. I'm afraid I might of over done it a little. ???
(http://i.imgur.com/suc28IP.jpg)
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It looks like your top limb is bending too much in the inner third but its a little weaker than the bottom limb also. I would take a few scrapes off the bottom mid and outer limb to even it up a little more and then the inner third on the top may not look like its bending too much. Hope that makes sense to ya:)
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It looks like your top limb is bending too much in the inner third but its a little weaker than the bottom limb also. I would take a few scrapes off the bottom mid and outer limb to even it up a little more and then the inner third on the top may not look like its bending too much. Hope that makes sense to ya:)
+1 almost got it bud.
Try moving your bow hand down a touch till it's at the center point of the bow. Then post another tiller picture. You seam to be applying more pressure to the top fade with your hand that high. JMO Patrick
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Well here it is...Did some fine tuning with the help of some guys at the Moon Tree Gathering and finished it after I got back. Just finished it quick and simple as I kind of wanted to be done and start another one with the knowledge I have now.
(http://i.imgur.com/pjT6SqB.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/ydZaJHe.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/6cshEbJ.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/zkCXsDW.jpg)
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That bow turned out nice. Its good to hear you are starting on another one. Glad you made it to Moontree this year.
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Really liked it and going to make sure I'm there for a lot longer next time. I'm already half way done with the next one, just slow on posting the pictures of this one. :laugh:
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Looks good to me, also. Again, it was a pleasure having at out little gathering.
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Hey Shane, that bow turned out nice.......
What kind of poundage did you end up with? I remember you thought you might not hit your target weight.
Glad to here your starting another one, it's addicting... isn't it.... :) ;)
DBar
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Looks real good shane! Pleasure meeting you at Moontree and hope you can make it to Scottsburg for a shoot. There's a thread in the club section on indiana traditional Bowhunters association. What wood are you using for the next one?
Tracy
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Danzn Bar: It ended up coming in at 35 pounds. Which is a little less but that's ok. For sure it's addicting. Wish I had more time to put into it. :laugh:
Tracy: It was a pleasure meeting all guys, I'm hoping I can make it out to Scottsburg and the next Moontree for sure. Next bow comes from the same hunk of Hickory that this first one came from. Probably try an Osage after that.