Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: Bowjo on September 13, 2010, 10:38:03 pm
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This is my first try with cane.I have made up about 10 arrows.I am really having trouble getting good flight out of these.So far,I can only get 1 out of 4 to fly good.I have some that are 4 fletch and some 3 fletch.Some are very sensitive to which way I put the nock on the string (only two ways)...I am not sure if the problem is underspine,too uneven,or too much sinew on the feather ends.I am really happy that I can a few to fly good for hunting this year.I just hate to make so many to find out that I can't shoot them.Do you guys get alot of bum arrows when making a batch?......Joe
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Are you making sure that the stiff side of the cane is oriented towards the bow? If not this will drastically affect the flight of your arrows. If you've done that it's probably a spine issue.
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So what exactly is the problem with your arrows? if they are fishtailing they may be underspined. I made some, not can arrows, but they were to long hence underspined, so I shortened them from 32-25, bow draws 24 and now they fly exeptionally! check your fletchings too. Pics would be nice.
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Cane on average flies better than any commercial shaft if done right. Are they perfectly straight? Usually if I get a wierd flier it's either not straight or the fletching is off somehow. Spine issues will give you arrows that don't group together, but they will still fly straight, just left or right of the correctly spined ones.
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I put the stiffer sides towards the bow.Some have a left and right problem.Some have up and down problems.Some fishtail.Just can,t get them consistant yet...Joe
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Could be the nocks too.
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basic arrow flight indications (to my understanding)
porpusing: can be caused by nock positioning
hitting left of center: usually caused by to stiff a spine
hitting right of center: usually caused by to light of spine
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I hope you don't take this as a stupid question, but did you put the narrow end of the cane as the nock end?
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Yes I did : ;)
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eddie you were the only one to think of that
i'll bet thats the majority of his problem right there ;)
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Maybe I should check the spine on some of them.I had read here that most guys just sort them by weight and use them.I will also check my cuts on the selfnocks .....Joe
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I hope you guys are staying with me on this.Alot of trial and error.
I started with 24 pieces of cane I had cut.I found wher they were 11/32 in diameter and went 15"'s each way for a 30" shaft.
I then weighed them:4=300-350grns,6=351-400grns,9=401-450grns,2=451-500grns,3=500+grns.
I then chose the 401-450grn shafts to make my arrows.That is when I started posting.
The 2 selfbows I made these arrows for are 55-64#'s.It seems my arrows are very underspined.Since my last post,I got a 35-42# selbow off the wall and most of the arrows shot good.
Now for some new questions.It seems that the only shafts with heavy enough spine are around 500grns or more with nock end being close to 3/8's and the front being 1/2"+ in diameter.My method for cutting shafts didn't result in many 500+ shooters for my bow.What diameter do you consider too large for River cane arrow shafts ?What would be your largest nock end?What would be your largest point end?I think if I bump up the size on my shaft cutting that I will end up with some pretty large diameter shafts.
I don't know if I will get any made for hunting season this year as I am about out of turkey feathers and dried shafts right now.I really appreciate all the help and advice.Thanks again Joe
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For an average 11/32-23/64" (point end) river/switch cane shaft I've been hard pressed to get 50# spine. So yeah, it does sound like you're under spined.
For bow's in your weight range I would suggest you look for other suitable material such as tonkin, bambusa, sasa or Japanese arrow boo. You may find a few hill cane that will work. Hope that helps. ART B
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i would say a majority of the cane/bamboo shafts that you get raw, they will be underspined for what you have. ive straightened a few hundred shafts over the last year. a majority of them are 50 and under, 1/4 of them were 45-60, and the rest were 60 and above.
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Just remember, you will need to allow about 10-15# of extra spine because of the cane's natural taper to get what you want. And add about 5# for every inch longer than a standard 28" arrow.
So to make a cane arrow spined @ 50# and 30" long you're going to need something in the range of 70-75# to start with. Not easy to find in our natural canes and still wind up with a decent diameter shaft. ART B
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I got one made tonight that spined 75 on the sides and 60 something top and bottom.It flys great so far.I checked my largest dry shafts and believe I have two more.I will get these made up and see how they all do.I have 60 other rough cut shafts that have been drying in my garage for two months.
I would still like to know what the largest point end diameters you guys have used.I will be using flint and obsidian points on these.I believe I can cheat a little past 1/2" and still be okay.It is kind of important for me to use natural shafts that I have harvested myself.
I cut the trees that I made my bows with,feathers from my turkey,sinew from my deer,and points I knapped.Just trying to keep it primitive,exept my string I used bought material for that.......Joe
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One thing I found out when weighing stone points was how light most of them weighed out to. I think it would also help if you didn't limit yourself to 30" arrows. You can shoot longer shafts 34, 32" and still give yourself more working room.
I've used point end diameters of 1/2". If you taper and watch the transition sloping back you should have no problem with penetration.
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You also need to make sure you get mature cane at least two years old, it will have thicker walls. Where the shoots come out of the side, the more the better, most cane puts out two or three per year. So, when you cut cane, go by how many shoots, six or eight will be strongest. Cane also dies back every three years, so make sure is not dying back. Bill
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I've had issues with cane not drying out completely. If your cane is not completely dry, it will be very flexible....resulting in thicker arrows. Cane can take years to dry out in humid climates. I've tried scraping off the outer skin and that works pretty good (allowing the cane to dry much faster) but it is very time consuming. You might experiment with heat tempering, a technique used by Asian arrow makers to dry and stiffen bamboo.