How far, how fast?

[stuckinthemud]

Ok, so, I want to see what weight a stave will give me, I am NOT chasing a draw weight.  I have a decent quality yew stave and the tapers are ones I have used before.  At the get go, the bend is good and there is zero set with the bow bending a few inches but not at low brace. There are schools of thought about teaching the bow to bend.  So, how hard do you chase the bend.  The primary aim for this build is to get as close as possible to zero set, so using the beginning of set as a guide is not one I want to use. I haven’t heated in any reflex but I want the bow to be dead straight when finished.

[superdav95]

Im by no means an expert in yew and still learning.  that being said ive noticed that creeping up on the tiller with yew in particular is best.  i guess one could say that with all wood species bows.  Good osage is way more forgiving imo.  Its very easy to mess up on a yew wood bow as its relatively soft and scrapes can take off more wood then expected.  Creeping in on the tiller i find is best and i like to sand with 150 grit after each scrape session then work in the limbs with some bending.  I like to start early with even bend on both sides throughout the entire bending portion of the limb.  ive heard some like to get the inners looking good and then focus on the outers.  I find i tend to do that with osage but not with yew.  I find that yew tends to take more set then osgage or fire hardened white woods like hickory.  Even when i have done some heat corrections on yew to try and remove some deflex it tends to creep back to original deflex.  With yew i find it does not seem to hurt its performance though.  It seems to be nice and springy wood regardless to a point.  Ive had a few explode on me over the last few years and learned that too much heat is an enemy to yew.  anyway for what its worth i tend to creep up it as far as tiller goes with yew in particular.  getting the bend nice and spread out through entire limb evenly early on working towards brace seems to keep set to minimum. 

[sleek]

Ok, so, I want to see what weight a stave will give me, I am NOT chasing a draw weight.  I have a decent quality yew stave and the tapers are ones I have used before.  At the get go, the bend is good and there is zero set with the bow bending a few inches but not at low brace. There are schools of thought about teaching the bow to bend.  So, how hard do you chase the bend.  The primary aim for this build is to get as close as possible to zero set, so using the beginning of set as a guide is not one I want to use. I haven’t heated in any reflex but I want the bow to be dead straight when finished.

A bow with no set starts with a bow of the proper dimensions. I've got a formula that will tell you the exact draw weight a bow will take before taking set based on the wood type and dimensions. If you tell me the dimensions, I'd be happy to tell you the draw weight that bow will handle before it takes more than 3/8 inch set.

Disclaimer: ( of course there is one ) I've been working on this formula for YEARS and it works perfectly on osage. I've dabbled with it in other wood types but have not proven it yet with other woods. It seems to hold true and I'm looking for other woods to try this formula on. If you are willing to give it a go, I'll run the numbers for you.

[Zugul]

A bow with no set starts with a bow of the proper dimensions. I've got a formula that will tell you the exact draw weight a bow will take before taking set based on the wood type and dimensions. If you tell me the dimensions, I'd be happy to tell you the draw weight that bow will handle before it takes more than 3/8 inch set.

Disclaimer: ( of course there is one ) I've been working on this formula for YEARS and it works perfectly on osage. I've dabbled with it in other wood types but have not proven it yet with other woods. It seems to hold true and I'm looking for other woods to try this formula on. If you are willing to give it a go, I'll run the numbers for you.

is this an invite for anyone or just for the thread's author? because I'd love to send you some measurments 

[Hamish]

PA Crowd chants "Sleek! Sleek! Sleek! Sleek!"

[superdav95]

Add me to this list.  I’d love this information from sleek! 

[sleek]

A bow with no set starts with a bow of the proper dimensions. I've got a formula that will tell you the exact draw weight a bow will take before taking set based on the wood type and dimensions. If you tell me the dimensions, I'd be happy to tell you the draw weight that bow will handle before it takes more than 3/8 inch set.

Disclaimer: ( of course there is one ) I've been working on this formula for YEARS and it works perfectly on osage. I've dabbled with it in other wood types but have not proven it yet with other woods. It seems to hold true and I'm looking for other woods to try this formula on. If you are willing to give it a go, I'll run the numbers for you.

is this an invite for anyone or just for the thread's author? because I'd love to send you some measurments 

I dont want to get over run with bows to calculate but I am happy to do one for some folks. I just don't want anyone to feel left out if I don't get back to them quickly. But for these next few days, I have time. Post your bows stats here and I'll run them to see what they should weigh to prevent excessive set.

I need the dimensions of the bow.
Total length
Length of all non bending parts, tips and handle
Width profile of all bending parts starting from the fades towards the tips.

Example: 
Wood type: Balsa
Nock to nock 62 inches
8 inch handle
6 inch stiff tips
1.5 inches wide at the fade for 3 inches past the fade
1.25 inches wide at 4 inches past the fade
Even taper to .5 inches wide 18 inches from fade
6 inch Stiff tips after 18 inches

There aren't real bow stats but an example of what I need to plot the bow out. Give me enough detail I can make a bow at home exactly like yours.

I dont need draw length, that has nothing to do with set.

My inbox stays full so just post the information here

Again, I want to stress, this is something I'm very confident in with osage. I've designed and built world record shooting bows with this formula. But I haven't done much at all with any wood outside osage so this is experimental with all other woods. But, it should work. Be prepared to be surprised at how underbuilt most bows really are.

[Zugul]

well, I'm not wasting this opportunity!

Wood type: Black locust
bendy handle bow
Nock to nock 62 inches
4 inch handle section, bending (2" above and below geometrycal centre of the bow)
3.4 inch stiff tips
1.3 inches wide in the handle section
Even taper to .67 inches wide 25.67 inches from fade
3.4 inch stiff tips after 25.67 inches

thanks! I hope to not be too far off

[sleek]

well, I'm not wasting this opportunity!

Wood type: Black locust
bendy handle bow
Nock to nock 62 inches
4 inch handle section, bending (2" above and below geometrycal centre of the bow)
3.4 inch stiff tips
1.3 inches wide in the handle section
Even taper to .67 inches wide 25.67 inches from fade
3.4 inch stiff tips after 25.67 inches

thanks! I hope to not be too far off

Ok, running my numbers, your bow should be 34 pounds to take virtually no set. Now that I've calculated that, what is your draw weight, and what is your set? Also, just for further information,  did you have any reflex, and did you heat treat the bow? That isn't calculated yet, but I'm not certain it needs to be yet either.

[Zugul]

that's PERFECT! keep in mind I'm still working on that bow but my goal weight is 35# at 28". At the moment I'm long string tillering it and it is around 35# at 4" so not even close to full draw. It has around 0.8" of reflex, it's not heat treated but I used dry heat to straighten it in a cuple of spots. For now it's not taken any set (the reflex is the same I had from the start). Now let's hope I don't mess up the tillering process, if the bow survives my very untrained eye and doesn't fret I'll let you know if and how much set it took.

[sleek]

that's PERFECT! keep in mind I'm still working on that bow but my goal weight is 35# at 28". At the moment I'm long string tillering it and it is around 35# at 4" so not even close to full draw. It has around 0.8" of reflex, it's not heat treated but I used dry heat to straighten it in a cuple of spots. For now it's not taken any set (the reflex is the same I had from the start). Now let's hope I don't mess up the tillering process, if the bow survives my very untrained eye and doesn't fret I'll let you know if and how much set it took.

Post a build thread and post lots of pictures. Rely heavily on all the good advice you get. My numbers rely on a perfect tiller. Take your time. Eternity will pass. May as well take a few moments to do it right.

[Zugul]

Post a build thread and post lots of pictures. Rely heavily on all the good advice you get. My numbers rely on a perfect tiller. Take your time. Eternity will pass. May as well take a few moments to do it right.

I've already started one, it's called "is my project doomed from the start?", soon I'll update it 

[sleek]

I can do a couple more if anyone has any they are interested in

[superdav95]

Ok here’s one more of you have the time to crunch the numbers.   



Wood type: pacific yew high elevation very tight rings (80-100 rpi)
Nock to nock 64 inches
5” inch handle. 2” fade each limb.  (9” handle/fade)
8” inch stiff flipped tips
1.75 inches wide at the fade for first 12” inches past the fade. 
Slight taper from 1.75” to 1.50” wide from 12” mark to 20” mark.  Then gradual taper from here to 24” mark to 1”wide.  From here out to the tips tapered again to .5” at end of tips.
Basically Parallel for first 12” and then a staggered even taper out to tip ends. 

Hope this makes sense.

Cheers.

[sleek]

I'm having trouble getting your numbers to add up. 
You have a 64 inch bow. Cut that in half and it's 32.
Half the 9 inch handle is 4.5
Stiff tips is 8 inches
12 inch parallels at 1.75
8 inch taper to 1.5
4 inch taper to 1

So 4.5+8+12+8+4=36.5, thats too much, it needs to equal 32. Unless the last 4 inches is part of the stiff tips. I'll assume thats the case. I'll calculate it that was as that seems most likely. Also, I assume this is a stiff handle bow?

I get 41 pounds to take 3/8 or less set. If I assume you built the bow to 50 pounds, I'd guess you have 3/4 inches of set. But, this is new and I'm trying this out, so I could be way off here. What are your actual stats, draw weight and set, if any?