My horn bow build-a-long

[sleek]

It is doing this because it is a light bow.

Do you think you could explain that somehow, it makes no sense to me. To me that's like saying a rat trap will work and a mouse trap won't. Exactly the same design but the rat trap has more tension.

So to me. Not "as simple as that"

Perhaps it's because a heavier bow will stress the materials to their max faster, And stretch the back more and faster so you have less time of it getting broke in. Like a string, when you stretch it, the string stretches to it max faster on a heavy bow, than it would on a lighter bow, so as time goes on, you need to add a few twists to the string as it gets broken in over time, vs a heavy bow that stretched the string on the first couple draws.


Just a wordy guess on my part. I'm certain a knowledgeable reply would mean more, but I can see how that could work.

[bownarra]

I said 'simple as that' because that is the only reason why it is 'flip floping'. None of the other stuff.
Nothing like your mouse/rat trap analogy
Thinner limbs obviously have less material in them, most importantly less wood. Wood being by far the stiffest material in a composite. The wood gives the bow its shape and is generally the cause when a bow doesn't bend right or resists bending correctly.
Horn bows made with no core are very prone to this problem.
Light weight hornbows have to have thin component pieces however I like to go as thin as possible with the horn,2mm max with the sinew and leave the wooden core as thick as possible.
Trust me a 100# bow is a whole different animal than a 40#'er performancewise and ease of tillering.
Think about making a wooden kids bow. using 'normal' adult lengths/widths etc - say 66", 1 3/4" wide but instead of 50# only 20#    how would that bow react to 'normal' belly tillering (compared to a normal adults bow). Sensitive eh? The wooden bow and the hornbows have little to be able to directly compare but this shows that IF you don't scale everything it WILL NOT act the same. Your hornbow isn't a scaled version of an original and couldn't be so you have to deal with these 'issues' which arise because of the differences.
 

[DC]

And so ends my hornbow thread. Can't say I'm sorry. I was getting pretty tired of waiting for this to happen. 9 months is a long buildup. So I think the problem was too much reflex in the sal. I looked at a lot of pictures before I made the caul and I was convinced that this is the way it should go. By the time bownarra pointed out the fault it was pretty much too late to do anything but forge ahead and hope. It broke before I got it to brace height. I had it bent a lot further before I resinewed it. This is the limb that the horn cracked on but whether that had anything to do with it, I don't know. I would not recommend making a hornbow unless you have a mentor. Even with Adam's book most of the time I felt I was groping in the dark. Thanks a lot to everyone that helped especially bownarra an JNystrom. I don't think I'll try again

[Deerhunter21]

 NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO 

[sleek]

If I have the ability,  I'd supply you the material if I could somehow bribe you into making another. You have a certain level of mastery about everything I have seen you build. I'd love to see you do a follow up to this thread with lessons learned.

[DC]

I've got everything I need. I could soak it all apart and with any luck the core would still be good. I originally bought 4 pieces of horn. I just don't think the desire is there.

[DC]

Question for bownarra. There is no way to salvage this is there? Even if there was I'm still stuck with too much reflex in the sal. Should I throw it in the baby bath to soak it apart. At least get my sinew back.

[BowEd]

Sorry to see that DC.You may not believe it but some of us have been through this type long term and even longer failure conclusion before.
If there was a crack on the horn that migrated to the edge it probably was the cause.Every one has it's lessons to be learned.
I see your starting a different bow but a bow.That's what I did too.Get back on the horse.

[bownarra]

I'm sorry but i'd say that is the end for this one.
When soaking them it takes forever to get the horns off in one piece, even if you could the core/sinew is too 'floppy' to glue the horn onto properly. I would just try to salvage the sinew.
Sorry to see this happen. You have the patience - try again! It took me a few failures and many lonely hours in the shop (with Adam's book!) to get my head around them fully.  Once you've made the mistakes the lessons learnt don't go anywhere in a hurry haha.

[WhistlingBadger]

Bummer, DC.  Thanks for sharing your effort with us.  I admire your patience.

T

[DC]

I'm sorry but i'd say that is the end for this one.
When soaking them it takes forever to get the horns off in one piece, even if you could the core/sinew is too 'floppy' to glue the horn onto properly. I would just try to salvage the sinew.
Sorry to see this happen. You have the patience - try again! It took me a few failures and many lonely hours in the shop (with Adam's book!) to get my head around them fully.  Once you've made the mistakes the lessons learnt don't go anywhere in a hurry haha.

OK into the soak it goes

Bummer, DC.  Thanks for sharing your effort with us.  I admire your patience.

T

Thank WB. I think one of the reasons I didn't enjoy this as much as I could is my lack of patience. I like the "instant" gratification of a self bow. Another reason is not knowing what the draw weight will be. It seems that you have to make four or five of these things in order to have it turn out within the limited DW range. With a selfbow you can tiller it down to one pound if you want. With these it seems like there just isn't enough latitude(?). With this bow for instance there was a good chance it would fail because I got the design wrong. Even if I got lucky and it held together there was a good chance that it would be over my 40# DW. If it was it might as well be broken, it would be useless to me.

Anyway, I'm a bit bummed just because I failed but it's no big deal. I may make another but I don't think it would be a Turkish type. A little to unstable for me. maybe I'll try one like BowEd does. I do have two nice strips of horn. It would be a shame to cut them up for tip overlays

[sleek]

Oh gosh yes, BowEd makes absolutely beautiful bows!

[BowEd]

sleek....I think you shot mine at Mo Jam 1 year at 15 to 20 yards and hit the 4" target right off the bat.
The making of bows from composites always amazes me as to the extremes a natural material will take along with their performance.Shooting them too.When made right they can seem almost indestructable.
There's a lot faster ways to get a very good shootable bow though DC like you said.
 

[Aaron H]

That's a bummer DC.  I hope you get back on the horse, you got this.

[sleek]

sleek....I think you shot mine at Mo Jam 1 year at 15 to 20 yards and hit the 4" target right off the bat.
The making of bows from composites always amazes me as to the extremes a natural material will take along with their performance.Shooting them too.When made right they can seem almost indestructable.
There's a lot faster ways to get a very good shootable bow though DC like you said.

You recall correctly. Only twice before has a bow felt like it was part of me. Your arrows were tuned perfectly to your set up as well. Shooting that bow and arrow, felt like I was projecting myself toward the target rather than simply shooting a bow. It was satisfying to say the least. I'd take a loan against my truck for one of your bows.

Given DCs level of craftsmanship, attention to detail, coupled with his eye for art, he would no doubt craft a beautiful bow if he followed  your style.