Horn bow question.

[gorazd]

gently ..... i mean that be careful and do not destroy (overheat) the glue if you are using heat gun 

By "gently" what do you mean? I'm thinking the idea is to remelt the glue so is that like warm to the touch or hot to the touch? Can you give me a better idea? Especially after wrapping it in rope it's going to take a bit of heat to get to the glue joint.

[JNystrom]

I would not use gelatin for horn wood joint...  but for sinew layer it can be used ...

Books with Masters of hornbows recommend ONLY fish/sinew (mix) glue for horn-wood glue joint and PROPER  sizing (both parts) with thin solution of fish/sinew glue, at least (!!!) 20 layers of thin hot glue.
GENTLY  Heat both parts (wood, horn) with heat gun before each sizing and wait to dry each layer !!!
 Whole procedure of sizing took me couple of hours.
Then add additional fish/sinew/hide glue parts into melting pot and make THICK solution.

Then just one very thick layer of HOT fish/sinew/hide glue (I mixed all because run out of home made cat fish glue) and quickly press together and do fixing with rope-tencik or clamps.
After fixing GENTLY heat up all with heat gun and let dry one day ...

I've made all of my bows with hide glue. Some of those have self made sinew glue on the sinew backing, but they are the worst glue jobs... Making your own glue is not always so easy. We need to remember, horn-wood glueline is the ultimate test for your glue, stresses in sinew backing are nothing close to it. It mostly boils to that its so hard to get the glue stick in to the horn part.

Another thing about the glueing and sizing is, when laying the first layer of hide/sinew/gelatin glue on the horn or wood core, you need to heat up the pieces and use thin glue. This will make the surface suck up more glue into itself, cause with the extra heat glue will stay longer liquid and run down to those fibres. After this heating is not recommended, since it degrades the glue, making it more brittle and we dont want that. After laying out the layers, what ever amount it is (i've used with success 5 to 60 layers in total) you heat up the pieces gently and use really thick glue for the last layer. Please don't use heat gun, you can really fast destroy a lot of work, hot plate or oven in low temp will do. With a lot of work i mean, its best to lay out the layers over some time so the glue hardens between the layers, maybe in 3 hour intervals. Also i allways let the last layer cure for 24 hours.
Finally when gluin the parts together you want to use thick glue, so it will fill all the small cracks and miss match in the core, but also you want to have it not setting until the clamps are fixed on place - this is why we heat up the core and horn, again to keep the glue running. So you will have only two times when you heat up the core and horn. Adam Karpowicz goes to detail in his book about Turkish bows, so if you are interested, you really need that book.

In general you just want decent hot glue in every possible place and it staying in its place. Gelatin/gnox/hide glue will definitely do. If someone wants to go really deep in to hornbows, then maybe a isinglass glue will be a good option but i would prefer to first practice with something else than buying some glue that costs 50-100 euros for 1 bow.

Mafort: All these tips work for a wood-horn-sinew bows or horn-sinew bows. Just go for it!

Now looking back, the guy only asked do you need to have your glue hot and we started to ramble! Yes, have the glue hot! Hah.

[Mafort]

I would not use gelatin for horn wood joint...  but for sinew layer it can be used ...

Books with Masters of hornbows recommend ONLY fish/sinew (mix) glue for horn-wood glue joint and PROPER  sizing (both parts) with thin solution of fish/sinew glue, at least (!!!) 20 layers of thin hot glue.
GENTLY  Heat both parts (wood, horn) with heat gun before each sizing and wait to dry each layer !!!
 Whole procedure of sizing took me couple of hours.
Then add additional fish/sinew/hide glue parts into melting pot and make THICK solution.

Then just one very thick layer of HOT fish/sinew/hide glue (I mixed all because run out of home made cat fish glue) and quickly press together and do fixing with rope-tencik or clamps.
After fixing GENTLY heat up all with heat gun and let dry one day ...

I've made all of my bows with hide glue. Some of those have self made sinew glue on the sinew backing, but they are the worst glue jobs... Making your own glue is not always so easy. We need to remember, horn-wood glueline is the ultimate test for your glue, stresses in sinew backing are nothing close to it. It mostly boils to that its so hard to get the glue stick in to the horn part.

Another thing about the glueing and sizing is, when laying the first layer of hide/sinew/gelatin glue on the horn or wood core, you need to heat up the pieces and use thin glue. This will make the surface suck up more glue into itself, cause with the extra heat glue will stay longer liquid and run down to those fibres. After this heating is not recommended, since it degrades the glue, making it more brittle and we dont want that. After laying out the layers, what ever amount it is (i've used with success 5 to 60 layers in total) you heat up the pieces gently and use really thick glue for the last layer. Please don't use heat gun, you can really fast destroy a lot of work, hot plate or oven in low temp will do. With a lot of work i mean, its best to lay out the layers over some time so the glue hardens between the layers, maybe in 3 hour intervals. Also i allways let the last layer cure for 24 hours.
Finally when gluin the parts together you want to use thick glue, so it will fill all the small cracks and miss match in the core, but also you want to have it not setting until the clamps are fixed on place - this is why we heat up the core and horn, again to keep the glue running. So you will have only two times when you heat up the core and horn. Adam Karpowicz goes to detail in his book about Turkish bows, so if you are interested, you really need that book.

In general you just want decent hot glue in every possible place and it staying in its place. Gelatin/gnox/hide glue will definitely do. If someone wants to go really deep in to hornbows, then maybe a isinglass glue will be a good option but i would prefer to first practice with something else than buying some glue that costs 50-100 euros for 1 bow.

Mafort: All these tips work for a wood-horn-sinew bows or horn-sinew bows. Just go for it!

Now looking back, the guy only asked do you need to have your glue hot and we started to ramble! Yes, have the glue hot! Hah.

Don’t ever apologize. I want as much information as possible and you all rambling on about all this is giving me all this new info I gotta have more lol. That’s how I know the archery bug is sticking to me. I want everything you all can share and then some. If there’s a process that makes it easier or that makes it nicer please share it. I’ll never turn down info or say it’s wrong unless it’s some outrageous claim. You guys are really helping me out so keep it comin.

[Mafort]

How thick should that horn be? Because right now its reduced to .25”

[JNystrom]

Well good, no prob.

Horn should be thicker i guess. I use .25" horn for my hornbows with wood core.
But at least you can get a light weight bow.

[Mafort]

I figure if my sinew backing with make up about half of the finished bows thickness I should end up pretty close to hunting weight

[Mafort]

I also kinda want to know how get it straighter. I’ve boiled it for 10 minutes and then tied between two boards but I don’t know if that did it