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Author Topic: First Bow Build  (Read 5053 times)

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Offline IrishJay

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First Bow Build
« on: November 24, 2018, 07:03:08 pm »
Hi everyone, I'm Jay, new to the forum. I'm planning to start my first bow build soon. I currently shoot a recurve that's just a hair under 70lbs at my 29.5" draw. I'm looking to build a longbow with a less poundage because I want something that will be smoother and less punishing to shoot.

I'm planning on starting with a You-finish unbacked  hickory bow from Ringing Rocks. So, my first question is has anyone dealt with them before and how is their quality? Any other makers you would recommend?

My second question is, about heat treating. I dont need this bow to be the fastest thing out there, if I wanted fast I would stick with my recurve, I want something smooth and forgiving to shoot, but I've read that unbacked hickory bows tend to take a lot of set and lose poundage once they are shot in. I was thinking I could heat treat the belly and induce a tiny bit of reflex into the bow so that as it sets it ends up fairly close to straight. I dont mind if it ends up with a little string follow or a little reflex I just dont want it to be to either extreme. Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance,

Jay
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"The best camouflage pattern is called, 'Sit down and be quiet!' Your grandpa hunted deer in a red plaid coat, think about that for a second." - Fred Bear

Offline upstatenybowyer

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2018, 10:10:39 pm »
Hi Jay and welcome to PA!

If it's your first attempt ever I wouldn't worry about a whole lot other than getting an even bend. Pull to your target draw weight as soon as you get it bending, but don't go over it. Keep removing wood a little at a time until you eventually get close to your 29.5". You can heat treat at that point, but remember it will increase the draw weight about 5 lbs or so.

I'm sure others will chime in with more input.

Best of luck!
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"Even as the archer loves the arrow that flies, so too he loves the bow that remains constant in his hands."

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Offline bjrogg

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2018, 06:24:40 am »
Welcome to Pa Jay. I think Upstate gave you some solid advice. I couldn't tell you anything about the u-finish bows. I've never tried one. Honestly I'd probably suggest spending the money on a good Osage stave and starting from scratch. I think I understand your delima though and nearly tried the u-finish route myself. I instead cut some ash and hop hornbeam and made my own staves. I don't know how the u-finish would have turned out, but I doubt I'd have learned as much and felt as much satisfaction from it. I've heard some bad reports on them but new bowyers can mess up a perfect stave to so hard to say. Like Jeff said. The even bend is the most important part of becoming a good bowyer. A clean unviolated ring for good tension strength on back is a very close number two. I haven't used Hickory yet either but have heard it very good in tension but not as good in compression. It does well in a dry climate. I'll let others comment on it though.
It really is all about the bend. Look at full draw pictures. After awhile you can see the difference between the good ones and the not so good ones. I'd suggest making a tillering tree with a pulley and scales so you can stand back and watch the bend and observe the draw weight. If you want to try board bow, there are some good sites for helping you build them to.
Good Luck. Hope you stick with it and feel that extremely satisfying reward of shooting your own selfbow that you made yourself. A word of caution though. It can be extremely addictive.
Bjrogg
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Offline IrishJay

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2018, 08:47:09 am »
Thanks for the welcome, and the input. I was leaning toward the you-finish bow because it is pretillered to weight and I was trying to keep it simple on my first build, but I definitely see your point about getting much more satisfaction out of building from scratch. Something Bjrogg brought up that I hadn't given much thought is humidity. I'm in Pennslyvania, where the weather's great if you're a fish. So osage probably is a better material choice than the hickory. Now I just need to get the boss (wife) to sign off on the budget so I can order some stuff to start building a tillering rig. >:(

Jay
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"The best camouflage pattern is called, 'Sit down and be quiet!' Your grandpa hunted deer in a red plaid coat, think about that for a second." - Fred Bear

Offline IrishJay

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2018, 09:29:09 am »
Another quick follow up question, I know a few places locally where there is some fallen timber that's be down long enough that it should be pretty dry. Theres some osage and some black locust that I could cut. Thoughts?
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"The best camouflage pattern is called, 'Sit down and be quiet!' Your grandpa hunted deer in a red plaid coat, think about that for a second." - Fred Bear

Offline StickMark

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2018, 10:09:58 am »
Hickory loses draw weight in humidity.  So, for Pennsylvania, think about osage, ultimately.  In Arizona, I can see very arid conditions, but when our monsoon rainy summer season arrives, the hickory bow's weight drops. 

Osage would be a great investment.  However, consider first making a board bow, to get your feet wet.  A nice long, 45# board would teach you a lot.  Or simply cut those osage and get started. Accept that you will eventually make many bows.

I agree with studying the photos of all the bows on this site.  As an example, I never really saw how a bow can bend at the fades until bowyers gave feedback on others' photos of their bows. Good advice. 

Set up a comfortable workshop or area.  I use a rasp, two grip clamps, sand paper, a knife and to cut to initial size, a hand saw or with boards a wormdrive circular saw.  Have two saw horses and a table on top.  That is it, plus a  luggage scale and a stick marked with inch increments.  Simple.

If it is a comfortable, relaxing place, you will take your time.

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Offline Hawkdancer

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2018, 10:21:05 am »
Welcome aboard, Jay!  The folks on this site have a wealth of knowledge about bow building and are very willing to help.  Get the "Traditional Bowyer's Bible, Vol 1-4". And read them. You can get them from the library.  Take your time working and have fun, but it can get a bit frustrating at times!  If you can cut your own lumber, it will need to cure, get the bark off asap, and seal the back and ends with shellac. I'm a newbie at this stuff and have just put the final touches on my first hickory bow. 
Hawkdancer
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Offline IrishJay

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2018, 10:29:25 am »
Mark,
What would be a good wood if I go the board bow route? And, would I need to back it, since I'm assuming most boards are not cut with bow making in mind and will probably have some growth ring violation?
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"The best camouflage pattern is called, 'Sit down and be quiet!' Your grandpa hunted deer in a red plaid coat, think about that for a second." - Fred Bear

Offline StickMark

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2018, 10:46:39 am »
Hickory seems semi-indestructible.  Natives used it in the humid eastern environments. Truly quartersawn boards seems best, where the grain is vertical (time for lots of image search, and search on this site, George T's site also). I have used somewhat quartersawn mostly.  I back many of my bows to protect the back from Arizona rocks.  Backing is easy: rawhide, TB3, etc, or linen cloth.  I am not sure it is necessary on for protection on good boards.  Be picky on the board selection. 

BTW, I got some advice regarding heat treating boards, basically "work on perfecting tiller skills first." 
On my last short draw bow build, I did not heat treat. Minimal set on that bow. 
Nonetheless, I have treated nearly all hickory, esp my staves, but find trapping the back (P Archer search again) the hickory and white oak works well to avoid excessive set. 
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Offline Pat B

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2018, 11:14:04 am »
Hickory is a good starter bow wood, one of my favorites and I've lived in the humid south all my life. If you keep the hickory bow in your home with climate control it should stay plenty dry enough. It takes a few days of being in real wet conditions for the bow to take on moisture and I'd bet it is overstressing a bow blank that causes set more than humidity.
 Adding a finish to a "you finish" bow isn't building a bow. With a little research(Check out George Tsoukalas site), go to Lowe's or Home Depot and pick through the stacks and get a red oak board(or hickory or hard maple) and build a bow from scratch. With the money you'll save from not buying the hickory bow you can buy yourself a few  hand tools and have money left over. I bet the boss would like that too.
 You have some of the best wood bow builders in the world right here to help walk you through from board to bow and it will be one you built yourself.   8)
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Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline bentstick54

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2018, 11:17:48 am »
The downed Osage could be a good choice for finding staves if there is any straight ones to be good candidates. But keep in mind it can still contain a lot of moisture inside. I picked up piece that was about 10” in diameter and was down for about 2 years. Brought it home, took the bark and sapwood off, but did not seal the back right away, and had it check terribly. Hard learned lesson. The wood can be seasoned, but still contain a lot of moisture inside. If you go that route, split it down to stave size, weigh the staves, and watch them until they stop loosing weight. Seal the ends as soon as you cut it, and once you take the bark and sapwood off seal the back. Every time you work on the back reseal it to avoid the risk of it checking  on you. Good luck anyway you decide to go.
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Offline IrishJay

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2018, 01:36:15 pm »
Ok fellas, I took advantage of the (semi) nice weather today and took my axe for a walk. This is what I came up with.
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"The best camouflage pattern is called, 'Sit down and be quiet!' Your grandpa hunted deer in a red plaid coat, think about that for a second." - Fred Bear

Offline Pat B

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2018, 02:40:01 pm »
Is it osage?  Both osage and locust can be used if already dead but not many others. But, a dead tree standing or on the ground will have lots of moisture in it due to capillary action, the moisture being drawn in from the ground. It may be seasoned but not dry.
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Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline IrishJay

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2018, 02:44:33 pm »
From the bark, I THINK its osage. (Hoping someone more knowledgable than me will weigh in). It was dead but standing when I cut it. It was a limb about 6ft up the dead tree. I'm about to debark, so I'll post more pics as I go.
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"The best camouflage pattern is called, 'Sit down and be quiet!' Your grandpa hunted deer in a red plaid coat, think about that for a second." - Fred Bear

Offline DC

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Re: First Bow Build
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2018, 03:14:32 pm »
The cut end should be bright yellow, shouldn't it?
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