Author Topic: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please  (Read 2592 times)

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Offline Muscat

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Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« on: August 28, 2018, 02:47:49 pm »
Hi All,

Long time lurker but my first post.  I am based in Oman and due to a gap in employment decided to try my hand at making bows...  My first effort at a snakey self bow was successful ish, in that it did not break - but at about 15lb probably not surprising!  My second attempt was a boo backed meranti r/d longbow.  The choice of woods was based on what I had lying around the garden...  Loved the way it uncoiled during the early pull, but alas the meranti was no match for the bamboo and it broke during early tillering...

After devouring the wealth of information on this site - my sincere thanks to those of you who give so freely of your hard learnt knowledge - I think I am better prepared to try again. My current bow is a bamboo backed desert hardwood.  I harvested the hardwood many years ago for a different project, cut it into 30” slabs and it has been sitting for about 10 years drying out. I believe it is a type of acacia/mesquite.  I have attached a photo of the grain and colour - can anyone ID the wood?  It has an sg of about 0.8.  Bamboo is an unknown variety from a garden centre, about 4" diameter before cutting.  The bow was laid out in a pyramid style, is 58.5” ttt, 57” ntn, a shade under 1 1/4” width carried 3” past a 4” handle, then tapering to 7/16” tips. The belly lam was 12mm originally, with a 1/8” boo backing tapered to about 1/16” at the tips,  The boo is trapped, but not, I think significantly.   Including the built up handle it currently weighs about 14 ounce.  One limb cracked near the tip on the belly during glue up when I attempted to induce some reflex.  I skipped the reflex, glued the bow up as a flat stave and repaired the crack with West System 105, which seems to be holding up fine.

I am aiming for 35lb at 28”.  I have it tillered to 32lb at 22”, looking for a circular tiller, but the bow is now developing set - about 1” so far.  I have been attempting to follow the “no set tiller” instructions, although I admit to forgetting when and where to take measurements occasionally! 

Looking at the tiller, I see both limbs bending more at the inner third near the fades, and I think that this is where the set is developing.  So my question - to relieve the stress on the inner third of the limb should I increase the amount of trapping on the boo backing in that area or reduce the width through the handle, or...? I know that I need to tiller the outer third of the limbs more, but should I do that first and would that decrease the load on the inner limb?  I am loath to put it back on the tiller tree in case I increase the set. I would like to keep the tips a little stiff.

The photos below show the current tiller at 22”. Apologies for the background, which makes it difficult to clearly see the tiller.  I have also attached an early F/D curve.  The numbers are a little sketchy due, I think, to using a very stretchy bow string i.e. as I slow down at each inch of pull to take poundage readings the readings float a little.

Many thanks in advance.  I like the feel of this bow and would rather not lose it to the learning curve!

Mark in Muscat

Offline bushboy

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2018, 07:27:24 pm »
Did you glue it up straight?got a side profile shot?the set tells the tale!
Some like motorboats,I like kayaks,some like guns,I like bows,but not the wheelie type.

Offline Muscat

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2018, 12:13:54 am »
Hi Bushboy,

Thanks for your question.  The bow was glued up straight, came out with about 1/2" of deflex, and now has 1.5" total deflex/set.  I have double checked a few samples of the the belly wood today - S.G. works out at 0.82.  With wood that dense, I hoped that similar dimensions to a boo backed ipe would work, but I'm now wondering whether I should have increased the width at the fades?


Offline Del the cat

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    • Derek Hutchison Native Wood Self Bows
Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2018, 02:01:51 am »
IMO your tiller is pretty good, but I'd suggest the bow is a bit short 62" or longer is a good length.
That hardwood looks a bit open grained (not that you can really tell from looking at it).
All bows take some set... the bow that is ramrod straight probably had an inch of reflex when it was glued up.
Don't beat yourself up.
Del
Health warning, these posts may contain traces of nut.

Offline TimothyR

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2018, 10:01:15 am »
Tiller looks good to me. Cant wait fo see it finished and shooting
Freedom dies one compromise at a time. III%

Offline leonwood

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2018, 11:53:57 am »
You obviously have done your homework, that’s great! Now the tiller looks good to me also, so the belly wood is probably not as good in comression to take on the strength of the bamboo and the short bow length. For this one a little extra trapping on the whole bow won’t hurt and maybe extend the bend as far as possible towards the tips to get more wood bending.
If you have some more of this wood, make it a little longer 64/66ish and you will be fine

Offline bushboy

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2018, 06:36:49 pm »
Very nice work and great advice given!maybe Google Tim bakers mantra,I think it sums it up well.
Some like motorboats,I like kayaks,some like guns,I like bows,but not the wheelie type.

Offline bushboy

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2018, 06:41:19 pm »
Sorry I just looked for it,maybe someone can provide a link or screen shot?I loaned that tbb years ago and never got it back,go figure.
Some like motorboats,I like kayaks,some like guns,I like bows,but not the wheelie type.

Offline ohma2

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Re: Boo backed desert hardwood - tiller help please
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2018, 08:18:44 am »
Good advice,your on your way to a good shooter.