what is the trick to rawhide backing

[PatM]

He didn't heat treat per his post. He was taking a few shots before heat treating.

[Springbuck]

Oh, ok.   I read it wrong, I guess.    There goes that part of the theory.

[aaron]

I dont see where you mentioned the type of glue you used. Perhaps the failure was due to the hide being too wet. When I do it, I take the fully wetted hide and roll It up in a towel, then stomp on the towel, unwrap and repeat.

[jayman448]

the glue could have also attributed. it was just an al purpose white construction glue. it did hold in some spots to the point where hyde fibers were torn out, but then totally smooth peel away elsewhere

[vinemaplebows]

Based on your description im not sure that the rawhide job was the culprit.  But i have backed almost everybow ive made for the cheap insurance it provides, or for artwork.  Ive used exclusively Titebond3.  First sand the back and acetone it to remove all oils.  If im heat bending the wood with oil, i do that first then make sure and remove that contaminated wood down to fresh wood and then acetone it.  Then mix a small cup of thinned down water and glue(approx two thirds glue).  You coat the back of the bow with this and let it dry.  You do this 2-3 times.  Your rawhide has been soaking for an hour or so and its now fully hydrated.  You scrape the backside with a knife against a board to remove any gunk/hair/membrane.  Put glue on the rawhide, smear it all over.  Lay it on the bow and starting from the grip work your finger all the way down removing any air pockets.  Wrap it in ace bandage letting it cure for an hour or so(meanwhile you do the other side).  After an hour remove the the bandage carefully, as the glue has now thickened but is still tacky enough you can make adjustments if necessary.  After this you are supposed to put the ace bandage back on to let it set over night but i have found this step unnecessary. By morning you can ususlly rasp the sides.  In 2 days time its hard like a rock.  I try and wait 10 days or so for the wood to cure back out.

Out of eveything on bow building that i have messed up along the way, this method has worked 100% of the time.  I learned it from Mike Yancys video.  I would still like to learn the method of hide glue better, and become as comfortable with its results.  But TB3 is waterproof and has been a fool proof method so far.

You are getting away with what you are doing and are happy that is what is important, but letting the glue dry, then reapplying to a dried surface is in my opinion not a good idea, to each his own.

[DC]

+1 I've read on a few glue sites that glue doesn't stick to dried glue that well. Some people size the surface, let it get tacky and then apply more glue and assemble. That makes more sense to me. Have you ever noticed that re-gluing a chair leg by squirting more glue in never seems to work.

[PatM]

Interesting that  so many people do the size and dry technique.

[vinemaplebows]

+1 I've read on a few glue sites that glue doesn't stick to dried glue that well. Some people size the surface, let it get tacky and then apply more glue and assemble. That makes more sense to me. Have you ever noticed that re-gluing a chair leg by squirting more glue in never seems to work.

That is the method I personally use.

[PEARL DRUMS]

I have sized with TB3 since day one, and let it dry hard over night. Zippo failures with skins or rawhide. Id say, at least with TB3, it works just fine.

[PEARL DRUMS]

Last night I added skins to a yew bow. I sized the back 2-3 days ago with TB3. I spread more glue on last night and applied the skins damp. I didn't get 2-3 minutes to adjust it and the skin was stuck tight already, trying to move it would have tore it.

[PatM]

  Trying it in a laminated glue up would establish if there actually are any drawbacks.  Certainly the chair repair scenario never works.

[PEARL DRUMS]

Wood on wood is another story. Skin or hide on wood is all together different.