Osage design recommendations?

[cool_98_555]

Hi guys,

Just got a really good osage stave in the mail today.  No knots, well-seasoned, good rings.  I want to make a selfbow with a stiff handle (the usual 4" with 2" fades), and I want 100# @ 29.  I want the bow to be as short as possible without sacrificing any performance.  I have made bows like this before but they have resulted in a bow with more set than I wanted in the end (Probably due to the narrow profile I used on them).  I am used to a width of 1 1/8 - 1 1/4, but I realize this may be too narrow for the numbers I want.  I want this bow to have almost no set, and I want it to be a longbow, with no reflex or anything heated in.  I want the back to just be a single ring and not have to back with rawhide or sinew or anything like that.  I like bows that have a parallel width half-way out the limb and then taper to 3/8" tips.  I'm just wondering what you guys think on the length and the width I should be using.

thanks!

[timmyd]

I would ask the partner that is going to help you pull that thing back what he thinks 

[cool_98_555]

The guy doing that is the guy that asked the question in the first place! 

[PatM]

Sounds more like you want a flatbow than a longbow.

[cool_98_555]

I just want a bow with no set.  I think a flatbow will get me there, so yes technically I think this will be a flatbow.

[Mo_coon-catcher]

I have a ELB style long bow that essentially matches those numbers and wouldve had almost no set of I didn't try pushing it to be 200#. It's 70" between the nocks and is 1 1/4" wide. It took about 2" of set because of that. I got it to 150# at 24" before a couple of nocks fretted and I dropped the weight to 100# at 30".  But it bends in the handle. It was slmething like 40rpi with a good ratio of early/late growth and was a dark orange color.
I would start with 30" fade to nock length at 1 7/8" wide to midlimb and narrow it down from there is it starts to show that it's too wide. I feel like that'll get you close of it's good osage. It'll show that it's too wide for the weight be getting real thin as you tiller it out. Then you can natrow it up a bit until you start noticing the faintest signs of set before continuing. Something like 1/16" or less, the. Stick with that wodth and finish out if you havmt already reached your draw length.

Kyle

[cool_98_555]

Wow thanks for the reply Mocoon.  Maybe it took 2" of set due to it being 1 1/4" wide?  Did it have zero set when you were pushing it at a 150# pace?  I've made a lot of heavy bows that were stiff handled and narrow and they all seem to have taken set so I've gotta get the limbs wider.  I'm thinking 68" or 69" will be fine for an overall bow length, and maybe starting with 1 3/4" fades? 

[Mo_coon-catcher]

It took about 1.5" of the set while pushing it 200# and got it to 20" before it got that much set and it was about 1 5/8" wide at tat point. So I dropped to 150# and about 1.5" wide and got it to 24" taking an additional .5" set and those two frets appearing in some knots. So I decided I torchered the wood enough and dropped the weight again. I think my widths were gone for the weights, but I just didn't have enough length to make it work. The overall length isn't even quite 6 foot. I think if I pushed for 100# at the git go I would've only seen about 1" of set. And if I would've heat treated the belly with the round belly shape it would've helped a bunch too.

Those numbers don't sound too bad. It atleast won't hurt to try them anyway.

Kyle

[bradsmith2010]

well most osage bows that are 50 ish, are about 1 1/4 to 1 1/2,,
so if you want 100 double that,..

[PEARL DRUMS]

70" ntn minimum, 1 5/8" wide minimum at the fades. Hold that full width until mid-limb and taper to the tips. Pretty much the same as Kyle stated, just a bit more narrow. Id rather have osage deeper than wider.

Also, I wouldn't start with anymore than 2" of reflex and hopefully its flat when your done.

[Badger]

70" ntn minimum, 1 5/8" wide minimum at the fades. Hold that full width until mid-limb and taper to the tips. Pretty much the same as Kyle stated, just a bit more narrow. Id rather have osage deeper than wider.

Also, I wouldn't start with anymore than 2" of reflex and hopefully its flat when your done.

   I always say that a deeper profile is a more honest profile because if the bow takes set it will show it. Very often on thin wide profiles the tension forces will pull the bow back into shape even when the belly has significant damage. I don't use set as my gage anymore, it isn't always honest. Meauring weight losses that occur because of bending as opposed to removing wood I feel is a much better gage of the condition of the wood. All that said I prefer a slightly wider profile if I am building a short working limb area type bow, the nmore bending limb I use the narrower and deeper the cross section.

[bradsmith2010]

if you want to go shorter than 70 inches,
you could go wider and even make it a bit bendy in the handle,,
I like the wider shorter bows, but thats just a personal preference, osage will do bout any design,,
I like the way the flat handle shoots for me,,,
Badger made a short stiff handel osage a few months ago,, I think it was over 100 

 

[Badger]

  Brad, I built the bow for 100#@26" but it has been drawn out to 28" and 112# many times now. The bow didn't take any set at all 62" long.

[bradsmith2010]

wow ,, I love that bow,,
could you please make a thread on it and post pics and stats,, 

[cool_98_555]

Badger what were your dimensions on that one?

Everyone likes something different and that's the beauty of it.  I just cut the bow to shape with a stiff handle and 1.5" limbs out halfway then tapering to 3/8".  It is about 68.25" long.  I could leave it like this but....call me crazy but I don't like any wider than 1 1/4" when it comes to osage.  It must be just me but i just think anything over 1 1/4 is too wide.  It may be crazy but it's just my opinion and it's how i like 'em.