Primitive vs modern glues for sinew

[Turtle dragon]

Hey guys,  I'm about to finally acquire enough sinew to graduate from self bows.  I'm wondering: any significant performance issues when comparing primitive glues, like hide or sinew glue,  to say for example,  titebond 3 for gluing the sinew to the bow?
Thanks in advance for responses.
-turtle dragon

[mikekeswick]

Modern glues won't give you the contraction you want with sinew and take forever to dry when used with sinew (very thick). Collogen glues have a few very useful properties that you can make use of and are perfectly suited to sinewing.

[Dances with squirrels]

Read this....

www.bowyersedge.com/glue.html

[osage outlaw]

My opinion on it is this:

Sinew + modern glues like TB = a backing that adds protection

Sinew + hide glue = a backing that adds protection and performance 

[Bob W.]

I use both hide glue and titebond 3 for sinew backing and they both work well. The TB3 is a little less messy!

[Pat B]

I go along with Clint(osage outlaw). I've made 5 or 6 sinew backed bows. On the first 2 I used hide glue on 2 courses and TBIII on the third for water proofing. On the others I used only hide glue with the sinew. There is a difference in performance if you stress the sinew like it should be.  I have added a thin coat of TBIII over sinew/hide glue as moisture barrier but other than that if I'm going to sinew back a bow it will be with hide glue.

[mullet]

The Tite Bond like glues do not give you any shrinkage like a Hide Glue does so there is no performance enhancement.

[Lumberman]

That was an awesome glue article DWS

[Turtle dragon]

So I'm using a 60 inch piece of hickory, making a flat bow, its too short for a self bow, so it needs a backing. I want to use hide glue because I don't see the point in using sinew just for protection, i could use rawhide or even fiberglass as a backing if i wanted protection. How do you guys feel about Knox gelatin glue? its basically just collagen glue, any durability/performance issues when it comes to Knox?
Thanks for responses so far. - turtle dragon

[Turtle dragon]

Also I noticed titebond has a hide glue line, has anyone ever used that stuff? what are the ingredients?
-turtle dragon

[Pat B]

Knox will work fine. Liquid hide glues will work but they have additives to keep them liquid and can be slow to dry. Use Knox if you don't have hide glue.

[Stick Bender]

I have used  titebond hide glue a lot in furniture making  and had a lot of fresh glue in my shop so when I wanted to make a sinew bow I decided to use it I have made 2 bows with it and have no problems ,when I read TBB I know they had isues ,but after 40 years of using liquid hide glue I immediately knew they were using ex spired hide glue it does have a shelf life like Dean says in his article but it's realy easy to know you got bad glue it will smell like rotten raw chicken that's been in the sun , it will usually take about 3 hrs at room tempreture to start to jell  after about 2 days all the retardant will be gone & it cures like normal , I noticed also in TBB composite bow chapter it recommends it so it was confusing to me but I just went with my past exsperience , on the bow I'm working on now I'm going to try the traditional hot pot glue to see if there's much of a difference ,if you do decide to use Titebond  hide glue it does have a exasperation date on it so if you get it online check with the supplier about that  Good luck with what ever glue you use.

[Danzn Bar]

If I was taking the time to sinew a bow I would use some quality hide glue ......period...............been there done that..
DBar

[loon]

fish bladder glue best glue, though i'd probably only use it for hornbows unless i had a ton or something

could combine sinew and hide glue too, good enough for wood bows and most hornbows

you can also reverse hide glue. I don't think I'd like removing expensive/hard earned sinew from a giant glob of TB3 very much.. if you have sinew, you can probably at least afford making some knox glue

what I have wondered is if it could be easier to make horn/wood gluing with some synthetic glue

[osage outlaw]

I've used knox on several bows with good results.  Whatever you use make sure to clean and degrease the back of the bow before putting the sinew down.