Penobscot (exploring the puzzle) SUCCESS

[half eye]

Fellas,
     I was looking at the Penobscot bows in Allely and Hamm's Encylopedia vol 1 and got to cogitating upon the in's and out's of putting one together. Well, went and did some research and came up with styles they did not show.....which really got the wheels spinning. I got reference drawings and photos of some at the Penobscot museum, which in addition to to the book indicates that there are least 3 distinct type double bows and one type of single bow.

I have added the pics of the museum displays at the Penobscot facility. It is very clear that the bow IS NOT a simple matter of 2 bows tied together. There are a bunch of questions before I build my final 3 penobscot's  It is very interesting on how these work. I thought if anyone was interested I would post up the step by step of my experiments and the questions involved. If there is none I will simply let the thread die out....otherwise I will document the process and what I have found out so far and will find out as the final bows come together. The full size model I have built and shot is quite the learning experience.....although it seems like I get one answer and 2 more questions

rich

[Pat B]

Post it, Rich. We all love this stuff.
 That is an interesting Penobscot bow. Looks more like a cable back bow.

[Thunder]

Hey Rich,
I'm very interested in hearing more about these bows, the concept of the double limbed bow has always amazed me.
Thanks for offering up your time and experiences.

Cheers
Thunder

[riverrat]

you got my interest. i made one about 12 years ago or so. with the mind set that its two bows attached to one another. i eventually broke it. but as i looked at pictures and thought about it more it got me thinking as well. one of my thoughts is was it actually a sapling bow split in two length wise, then both tillered accordingly to give a basic sapling bow a little more umph.interested in what you find.Tony

[bradsmith2010]

very nice,, would be great to see your build,, thanks for sharing

[wizardgoat]

Please post anything about these bows Rich. I'm working on one right now,  I really like the looks of that RD style one.
On some it looks like the strings of the mini bow would come into contact with the back of the main bow, but some appear like they wouldn't.
I've heard they can be very tough to make nice shooting bows, but when you nail it they're very smooth. I remember reading it's a good idea to get the main bow tillered 99%, with a little more bending in the inner limbs, because when the little bow gets attached these areas become very stiff.
What do you think about this stuff?

[Aries]

Also very interested in your research. I have been tossing over the idea of making once since I first saw the style in tbb.

[bubby]

please continue

[half eye]

Some of my initial questions were how to tie the bow's together as one has the back bow 1/2 length and tight to the main bow and the other has a shorter back bow wherein the rawhide strap runs between the two bows, catches the stub ends of the back bow and then on to the main bow tips.

Then the matter of the one type looks like a back bow but the other clearly is not. Before I could put a model together I needed a sense of how each part affects the other as to draw weight.... so I took a scrap piece of ironwood, it was very skinny at about 3/4" wide so I rough shaped it anbd roughed in the tiller, as well as steam bending the re-curved tips. To this I added a back bow right at 1/2 of the bow length and steamed into an overall reflex. This back bow is about 1/2" wide.

I weighed the main bow at 30# @ 25" as a self bow. I then tied the two together as in the Allely drawn type. When the bow was weighed it was right about 40# @ 25....this change was strictly from the two being tied together as the tips were not connected. Next I tied the tips together at moderate tension when unbraced....and then restrung the main bow. The combination drew just over 50# @ 25".

NOTE: During the restring (actually during the unstringing) the one main bow tip broke off right at the knock slot.....so I retied the strings as if the limb never had a string knock. and even with the limb length difference the weigh remained the same. In the full draw pic you can see the tiller has changed because of the short limb but is still pretty good....and still shooting arrows.

The biggest reason for all this is because I was gifted some very fine raw-hide by Oglala Bowyer and I dont want to ruin any of it without some idea what I really need , size, and attachment method.

I'll post again later on the questions I believe I answered and the ones I still need to look at. In the meantime here are the pics so far.
rich
PS: any questions please ask

[half eye]

more pics

[bubby]

So rich does that bow feel like it stacks

[half eye]

Not really "stacking" it just feels stiff all the way back. I think if you look at the bows from the Penobscot facility where there is only short "stubs" on the "back bow" I think the backbow is really just a bridge in a cable backed bow, kind of like the bridges in the Inue bows at recurves between the cable and the back. The styles that have a back bow with longer limbs is basically the same but like having " spring tension" in the cable. 

Thats one of my questions....the way the back string is attached would lead ya to believe that it was not un-done just simply the main bow was unbraced and left like that......there is not enough play in the main bow to allow the rawhide strap to be removed....thats why it has "slits" on @ end and not tied. The other issue is with the main bow string...it cannot be slid down the limb....it has to be untied. I need to look more at these items.

I believe that Pat B was right in that this bow shares quite a bit with a cable backed bow, but doesn't have to be "wound and unwound". But it still needs to be checked out.
rich

[Drewster]

Fascinating.......keep it coming.

[BowEd]

Kuddos to ya half eye.Interesting.

[burchett.donald]

  Rich,
          This is waaaay out of my league bud...But I will be watching with great interest and maybe learn something...Thanks for posting...That full draw looks like you figured out the puzzle...Very interesting
                                                                                                                                        Don