Author Topic: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?  (Read 15203 times)

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Offline PatM

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2015, 04:26:55 pm »
The narrow profile is due to choice of wood and sinew backing in many cases. Paradox is not a problem when the arrows are sticking out well beyond the bow hand at full draw and likely underspined to the degree that they shoot just right.

 You will also see  evidence of more of a wrist guard than an arm guard being used.

Offline bradsmith2010

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2015, 04:30:21 pm »
good point Pat, some of the arrows were over 30 inches long,, for a relatively short draw bow,,

Offline tipi stuff

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2015, 07:45:00 pm »
Astute observation Del "Also it might whack you on the wrist". You are correct! Here's a photo for you. Low brace height= whack on wrist.  CC

Offline Hrothgar

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2015, 07:53:41 pm »
Given Bradsmith's points 1,2, and 4 as true for all wooden bows, these would be the factors which an Indian bow maker could regulate (lessen)  to 'overbuild' his bow. Bowyers today and on this site realize that a theoretically perfectly tillered bow will deliver optimum performance while hopefully preserving the life of the bow for as long as possible.
Most native Americans didn't have the time or tillering tools that we allow ourselves today.
" To be, or not to be"...decisions, decisions, decisions.

Offline PatM

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2015, 09:01:46 pm »
Didn't have the time? They had tons of time.

Offline leaf_h

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2015, 11:52:47 pm »
I suspect that it was because that these Indian archers had a short draw length while shooting on horse.(some picture shows that they draw their bow at the height near their belly)
maybe low brace is more suitable for that pose.

Offline looper

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #21 on: October 29, 2015, 01:10:18 am »
I'd say that on those bows, it's due to the overall length of the bow. Relatively speaking, the brace height to length ratio is probably the same as a 6" brace on a 66" bow.

Offline PlanB

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #22 on: October 29, 2015, 09:51:51 am »
If there is some string follow and low brace height, the bow might be able to be left strung with little pressure to set additionally. Having a bow strung at all times could be handy in a surprise attack. If it was me I'd think about two bows, one strung for defense in a permanent encampment, one unstrung for hunting or raiding. Well, unless the strung bow was good enough for both, which, I suppose it could be, because, while string follow hurts cast, low brace height helps. It might be interesting to see what could be done with a bow optimized for continual stringing. I wouldn't be surprised if it resembled some native forms with similar low brace height preferred..
I love it when a plan B comes together....


John32r

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2015, 09:59:42 am »
If there is some string follow and low brace height, the bow might be able to be left strung with little pressure to set additionally. Having a bow strung at all times could be handy in a surprise attack. If it was me I'd think about two bows, one strung for defense in a permanent encampment, one unstrung for hunting or raiding. Well, unless the strung bow was good enough for both, which, I suppose it could be, because, while string follow hurts cast, low brace height helps. It might be interesting to see what could be done with a bow optimized for continual stringing. I wouldn't be surprised if it resembled some native forms with similar low brace height preferred..

Another good point. They had to keep the strings on their bows constantly.

Offline PlanB

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2015, 10:11:31 am »
We in the modern age tend to think of efficiency in linear terms -- measurable. Arrow speed for instance.

But efficiency in a wilderness life is measured in terms of survival. Selection and evolution works on tools as well as species. If your bow doesn't efficiently meet the requirements of keeping you and your family alive, you, and it, disappear.

So string follow and low brace height can have a use in terms of survival efficiency. In fact low brace height minimizes the amount of string follow needed to stay strung without deteriorating, in addition to increasing cast. Two positive effects.. Having a bow strung at all times is a similar effect to having a gun with a magazine as opposed to one that must be broken or rammed to load. High speed response is an adaptive advantage and results in the evolution of a tool, like a weapon.
I love it when a plan B comes together....

Offline PatM

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2015, 10:20:14 am »
 The bow carrying cases seem to indicate the bows were not actually strung at all times. They would be more holster shaped like the Asiatic variations if that were the case. Instead they are just like a bow sock.

Offline PlanB

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2015, 10:25:02 am »
Were all bows always cased?
I love it when a plan B comes together....

Offline PatM

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #28 on: October 29, 2015, 11:05:08 am »
Not when they were being shot... But if the bows were strung all the time they would have made different shapes of cases. Unstringing must have been done.

Offline sumpitan

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Re: Indian bows: Why such low brace height?
« Reply #29 on: October 29, 2015, 11:35:49 am »
Bows of the Native Americans were most definitely kept unstrung in most cases. There are many accounts of Native Americans doing just that, including with a reason given (sparing the bow from excessive strain), as well as the fact that the majority of NA bows have strings that have a fixed end and a noose end. Even the one-sided nocks favored in the Plains are so to make unstringing and stringing a bow easier. It works, too.

Low brace heights have already been discussed at length, and good reasons given. More cast, more durability are my reasons to use them. I shoot mostly 50" selfbows these days, with a 20 - 22" draw. My favored brace height with these is around 4 1/2", measured from the bow back. That's less than a palm width between bow belly and string. My short bow arrows are cut to drawlength, so they have no "overhang" at full draw. Also, I mostly use D-style bows, with the full width of the bow at the arrow pass. I have no issues getting perfect arrow flight with these, although I had to test lots of spine and point combos to find the right ones for this setup. You only have to do this once, and any Native American would have had pertinent insider knowhow to start with. Heavy arrowheads, as common on the Plains, help tremendously in getting clean flight and plenty of penetration without much length anywhere in the setup.

There is no bow style that was quicker and easier to make, starting from acquiring the raw materials, through roughing out, tillering and even stringmaking, than a short, narrow, bend-through the handle bow. It is a highly efficient weapon in this regard.

Tuukka