Author Topic: limb tip twisting problem???  (Read 4931 times)

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Offline thomas74p

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limb tip twisting problem???
« on: August 27, 2015, 10:23:55 am »
I'm working on another bow. longest one I ever made. think it's about 65''. has nice big recurves starting at 5'' from the tip end. recurve up almost 45 degrees. it's thin maybe less than 1/2'' wide and nearly as thick. when I went to brace it for the first time I quickly noticed that both tips curved or twisted to the left making the string run a good 2-3 inches out to the side of the handle. looks super bad. looks like it's gonna snap one off if I draw it like that. I have no idea what to do. My first thought is that I made it too thin and my only option is to cut the recurves off. but thought I would ask first before doing anything drastic. let me know what other info is needed to diagnose this situation. and thanks in advance for any hints or help.

Offline Pat B

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2015, 10:56:25 am »
Is your bow only 1/2" wide?   Pics will help us help you with the problem. Uneven thickness and lateral instability come to mind. being that narrow with recurves added is most likely the problem.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline Del the cat

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2015, 11:03:34 am »
Too late now :-[, but always leave bows wider than necessary at the ends until it's drawing about 20" or so.
It's a common problem with English Longbows and even more so if you have reflex...
Del
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Offline LittleBen

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2015, 11:05:51 am »
If you read recurve builds by the masters you'll see that even the most experienced guys will leave the tips wide until they're sure the tiller is correct. That way you can prevent twisting by slightly shifting the tips to one side or the other. 1/2" is pretty narrow for a recurved tip, even if the limb is a normal width like 1.25-1.5".

When I have misalignment of tips on a recurve I typicslly first check that the limbs are properly bending (one side isn't thicker than the other) if it looks good then I know it's misalignment of the tips. I will then use some mild heat bending to try to align the tips properly. This is best done slowly, a little bit at a time. A little goes a long way on recurve alignment. Heat bend a bit to the side you need, then let the bow cool fully, maybe an hour, check alignment, repeat until string is tracking properly. DO NOT TILLER FURTHER AT THIS POINT. The tips may be too dry. Just brace the bow to check alignment. Once yur alignment is on, let the bow rehyrrate for a few days to a week ... The is no such thing as waiting too long, but starting back on tillering too soon is a real concern.

If alignment becomes too difficult to achieve or if you don't have enough stability due to the recurves, you can shorten them an inch at a time until you have enough stability to continue. Go back to heating the tips for alignment as I discussed above after each time shortening.

Moral of the story, go slow at first, never narrow the tips until you absolutely have to (I.e. The bow is nearing completed tiller). A little bit of going slow in the early stages will save a lot of going slow at the end.

I'm sure others with more experience will chime in with their approaches as well.

Again please clarify the limb width so that others can direct their advice most accurately.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2015, 11:10:23 am by LittleBen »

Offline thomas74p

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2015, 11:43:29 am »
thanks guys. never thought to leave it wide till after it is being drawn. I've been trying the heat corrections all week. a spot here a spot there only one correction a day and checking the progress each day before trying more. nothing seems to be helping. I feel its just to thin and weak. the limb taper down to 1/2 inch and are only about 1.25 at the fades to begin with. so it's thin all around. but down at the tips its damn near a square profile. I don't want to tiller any more off as it's spot on now and pulling the weight I was shooting for. I think I'll try cutting an inch off the recurves. 1 inch at a time till it's right. I'll post some pics when I'm done. you guys will either love the color or hate me for messing up such a beautiful piece of wood. it's the darkest most reddish orange osage I have ever held. I'm in the process of rubbing in a 50/50 mix of bees wax and lard into the wood. good lord its amazing looking. I think I like sealing it with this better than the helmsman stuff. probly just gonna use it for now on.

blackhawk

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2015, 12:31:25 pm »
Welcome to the wonderful world of making recurves...sometimes they can be cantankerous lining up...but once ya got em licked its worth it imho.

Offline wizardgoat

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2015, 01:50:01 pm »
I usually always correct my recurves, even if they're off just a little.
Strap your bow down side ways so when you put a weight off the end of the hook
It'll bend the way you want. I always try to get the twist out right before the recurve.
I use a heat gun. I usually set up a ruler, or some blocks so I don't over bend.
I hope that makes sense, I know pics would've better.
Tip allignment on recurves is actually pretty easy, but my tips are around 3/4-1" wide at this point

Offline thomas74p

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #7 on: August 27, 2015, 01:54:36 pm »
wizard. thats close to what I've been doing. I've noticed with all other heat corrections over the years that they do tend go back a alittle the direction they came once the tention is released. shall I "over correct" just a tad? thats about the only thing I haven't tied yet. I will give it another week of trying before I go for the saw!

Offline Pat B

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2015, 07:45:46 pm »
Will you post pics?
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline Danzn Bar

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2015, 08:24:38 pm »
Welcome to the wonderful world of making recurves...sometimes they can be cantankerous lining up...but once ya got em licked its worth it imho.
Yep...... 10-4 on that one Chirs
I'm working on a "sort of molly" static recurve with real thin tips, not Blackhawk thin, but thin, and had to add some horn string bridges to keep string from coming off.  Its shooting pretty well at the moment.   Twist can be a problem with long thin tips...
DBar
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is looking

Offline thomas74p

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2015, 11:21:55 am »
Just finished re~recurving it as I had lost some while trying to get the twist out. Don't really want to brace it yet again till I'm sure its had time to settle in place. Not sure if makes a difference, just don't want to make it any worse. But here's a look at what I'm doing so far and its gorgeous color

Offline thomas74p

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2015, 11:23:51 am »
One more of the mid limb where it has some nice snakey. Not much but enough to give it a nice shape at least.

Offline Springbuck

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2015, 11:33:17 am »
 I, too like to leave them wider until after recurving, but often the twist is actually lower down the limbs, too, where there is uneven thickness side to side, or wibbles and waves.

I almost ALWAYS end up doing some heat and crank work on selfbow recurves.

Offline thomas74p

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2015, 11:37:20 am »
Here's a link to the photbucket. Its the original photos so it shows em better. Still look blurry to me. I can't ever seem to get a clear picture. http://s104.photobucket.com/user/THOMAS74P/library/Mobile%20Uploads?sort=3&page=1

Offline thomas74p

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Re: limb tip twisting problem???
« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2015, 01:30:16 pm »
think I may have the twists fixed. and have got it out and shot it on 3 occasions. seems to be a good bow but feels too tall for my personal taste. can't get over the color though so it will probably be one of my main shooters. oh yeah, it turned out 46lbs @ 26'' draw.  and shot 500 grain arrows pretty consistantly around 160-165 FPS http://s104.photobucket.com/user/THOMAS74P/library/bows?sort=3&page=1
heres some pics on photobucket and of course the FD
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 01:38:42 pm by thomas74p »