Author Topic: Phragmites  (Read 19254 times)

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Offline jeffp51

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Phragmites
« on: October 16, 2014, 10:08:40 pm »
I just saw in the previous topic that phragmites reeds can be used for arrows.  We have those by the zillions around here, but I always considered them too weak for an arrow.  does anyone have experience with them?  What has to be done to make them work?

Offline Newindian

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2014, 11:01:16 pm »
I think thunder has a set
I like free stuff.

Offline Pat B

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2014, 11:41:32 pm »
Jackcrafty has made Phragmites arrows and probably has a build along in the "How To" section.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline JoJoDapyro

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2014, 09:07:47 am »
Jeff, I could be wrong but I think the issue we have is the growing season. With winter kill it is hard to find them that have grown enough to have a more solid wall. I could be wrong, but I do know that is the issue we have with Bamboo here. I am going to try some and I can let you know.
If you always do what you always did you'll always get what you always got.
27 inch draw, right handed. Bow building and Knapping.

Offline Knoll

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2014, 09:13:37 am »
JackCrafty (AllergicHobbit on youtube) produced vids re these shafts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zLUbhqab5Y
« Last Edit: October 17, 2014, 09:58:34 am by Knoll »
... alone in distant woods or fields, in unpretending sproutlands or pastures tracked by rabbits, even in a bleak and, to most, cheerless day .... .  I suppose that this value, in my case, is equivalent to what others get by churchgoing & prayer.  Hank Thoreau, 1857

Offline Josh B

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2014, 10:50:14 am »
Joe is right about the growing season being important.  I have harvested quite a bit of phragmites around the country including Joe's neck of the woods around Salt Lake City.  It's important to give it as much chance to mature as possible.  I usually cut within a week of the first frost in northern areas as it deteriorates quickly after it goes dormant for the winter. If you cut some that isn't mature, it will shrivel as it dries and get a wrinkly appearance.  If it doesn't wrinkle its probably good to go.  When harvesting phragmites, look for the tallest culms with the narrowest diameter base.  The walls get thinner the higher up the culm you go so ideally you want your arrow from the lowest section of the culm.  Phragmites is high in spine for its weight so you'll want some pretty dense wood for the foreshaft to bring the weight up.  A knock insert is a good idea as well.  I use bamboo skewers that just fit inside the phragmites, slid all the way into the node, superglued and sinew wrapped.  Phragmites is the most delicate shafting I use, but if done correctly, will make some fine shooting arrows.  Josh

Offline JoJoDapyro

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2014, 11:05:45 am »
Jeff lives just south of Tyke and I Josh. Having seen Jeffs other work I am waiting to see what he does with these!
If you always do what you always did you'll always get what you always got.
27 inch draw, right handed. Bow building and Knapping.

Offline jeffp51

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2014, 11:52:25 am »
what wood works for a foreshaft?  that wasn't covered in the how-to mentioned above

Offline Josh B

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2014, 12:15:39 pm »
The biggest thing with the foreshaft wood is that it be strong and straight grain.  For lighter bows I've even used raminwood dowels.  To get your weight up for heavier bows, hickory, ironwood, mesquite, or anything heavy and dense.  I usually use dogwood shoots.  I haven't tried it yet, but ipe, bloodwood and other heavier than water exotics theoretically would be ideal to get the weight up. 
One other important tip about phragmites.  No glue will bond well to the outer skin.  Anywhere you intend sinew wrap or Fletch with glue needs to be roughed up with med grit sand paper or similar grit sandstone works well.  Also heat straightening phragmites is a delicate process.  Take your time and easy does it.  Josh

Offline JoJoDapyro

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2014, 01:36:35 pm »
Bamboo is the same way. It has to be bare "Wood" or nothing will stick.
If you always do what you always did you'll always get what you always got.
27 inch draw, right handed. Bow building and Knapping.

Offline Knoll

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2014, 08:56:06 pm »
Now know what those clumps of TALL grass plants are that dot the unkept "common ground" behind our place.  Was out there this afternoon collecting couple dozen and then spent rest of afternoon "processing" 'em.  GOOD DAY!   ;D
... alone in distant woods or fields, in unpretending sproutlands or pastures tracked by rabbits, even in a bleak and, to most, cheerless day .... .  I suppose that this value, in my case, is equivalent to what others get by churchgoing & prayer.  Hank Thoreau, 1857

Offline Josh B

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2014, 11:15:01 am »
Now know what those clumps of TALL grass plants are that dot the unkept "common ground" behind our place.  Was out there this afternoon collecting couple dozen and then spent rest of afternoon "processing" 'em.  GOOD DAY!   ;D

If you run out where your at, there's thousands of acres of it across the river in east st Louis.  I harvest a lot of mine along collinsville rd straight south of the race track.  Josh

Offline Knoll

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2014, 02:26:30 pm »
If you run out where your at, there's thousands of acres of it across the river in east st Louis.  I harvest a lot of mine along collinsville rd straight south of the race track.  Josh

Thanks, Josh.  Stuff out back is mighty thin-walled.
... alone in distant woods or fields, in unpretending sproutlands or pastures tracked by rabbits, even in a bleak and, to most, cheerless day .... .  I suppose that this value, in my case, is equivalent to what others get by churchgoing & prayer.  Hank Thoreau, 1857

Offline Josh B

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2014, 09:33:26 pm »
I'm afraid thin walls is the norm with phragmites.  No matter where I get it.  There's definitely more durable arrow materials in your area.  Josh

Offline jeffp51

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Re: Phragmites
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2014, 05:27:38 pm »
Just cut a whole bunch of this stuff from around Utah Lake this morning.  We will see if any of it is usable.