Yew longbow build-along low budget style

[Colindemo]

Hey all,

Me again with a build along. I did one in the warbow section of an Ash warbow which turned out quite nice, in part thanks to the help i recieved in that tread. So, i figured since this is my first yew bow i should start another build-along to get some tips and tricks on how to work with yew.

I started on my stave this afternoon and immediately discovered that the growth rings are way thinner than on an ash stave. This has made my job of chasing a growth ring very hard. Also, the colour differences on which you can discern separate rings are so small it's very easy to violate a ring imo. That's why is started chasing the third ring from the heartwood as to not be totally screwed when i muck it up. My first question: is there a way i can make the growth rings more visible so it's easier to chase them? I tried putting some liquid beeswax (used to protect furniture from the elements), this always makes the growth lines pop out in an Ash log, but this doesn't seem to help on yew.

Another question, and this may come a little too late since i already worked on the stave for a whole afternoon, but do i have to wear a facemask while working on the stave with a drawknife, scraper and woodplane? I know I should wear one while sanding etc, when there's dust particles flying around but i'm not sure whether it's also needed when roughing out the stave.

I will post a picture of the stave as soon as i have one and will also post what dimensions i will be aiming for because i'm not sure how much i can get out of this stave. Keep ye posted

[wizardgoat]

Theres no need to chase a sapwood ring in yew, ive never done it, but ive only built 4 yew bows so far.
ive heard of ppl using dyes or stains which really brings out the rings, but then you have to deal with removing it after.
wearing a dust mask is always a good idea, even though I never do. I just do the dusty stuff outside.

[WillS]

Don't worry about chasing a ring with yew.  Some do and some don't of course, but generally if you're aiming for a "sensible" weight bow, you won't need to worry too much.  It only really becomes an issue once you start looking for warbow weights, and even then you can get away with all kinds of crazy violations with yew. 

My first yew bow I just chopped straight through a load of knots and blasted my way through the sapwood rings just so I had a straight stave the right size, and it's still shooting nicely today!  It's one of those nice woods that lets you learn on it without it kicking you in the teeth if you make a mistake.

That being said, a single growth ring on the back is a) nicer to look at, and b) technically stronger, so if you want to do it, go for it.  You just don't NEED to do it.  If you are gonna do it, do it outside in really good light and once you've selected a ring to chase, use sandpaper when you're close. 

You say you're chasing the third ring from the heartwood - that sounds a bit close to me!  Make sure you've got a nice 1/8" thickness of sapwood all over, if not more for your first bow.  While yew can take violations, it won't like you going through the sapwood into the heartwood.  Much better to have a few feathered violations across the back and have 1/8" to 1/4" of sapwood for safety than try and get a beautifully thin, single ring and risk going too far!

As for masks etc - yew is toxic, and you don't wanna be breathing it into your lungs, but rasping/scraping/drawknifing won't be an issue.  Just don't chew the bits you cut off

[Colindemo]

The rings are quite thick on this stave for yew, i guess. There's at least 6 mm (sorry using the metric system) on the whole back. Tomorrow i'll just try to follow the ring i followed today without caring too much about leaving some of the ring above it. The stave does not permit me to make the bow too wide or think so i guess it isn't going to be a heavy one. I will post my progress tomorrow evening and some pictures

[Colindemo]

I'm sad to say that i've ruïned this longbow beyond repair. I removed to much wood from the belly about halfway into one limb until i'm virtually out of heartwood there.

I will try to salvage some of the wood to build a composite bow. If i succeed in turning this longbow project into a small composite bow i will post everything in one go.

[Del the cat]

Chasing a ring on a Yew back is tricky. You should see it as an aim rather than a necessity. The trick is getting light right and doing a little and often. Rough it with drawknife and spoke shave. The rings show best in an oblique light but it can be tricky.
After that stage I get it in a vice with a spot lamp at an angle, once you have one patch where you can see a ring, it can be slowly worked back. going across the grain with a bastard file or fine rasp held lightly works well , it crumbles off the lighter wood which I see as being like Chicken breast meat, it exposes the slightly darker yellow (and slightly firmer) of the next ring, a scraper will the clean off the last vestiges of the chicken meat layer
The thing is to do it in stages, first get the overally thickness about right, then as the bow progress you can keep tidying it up with rasp file scraper. Once it's to about brace height the back should be looking more even. Final scraping and cleaning progresses with the bow. This works well because you have less back to clean up on a near finished bow compared with a huge wide stave.
This post shows a Yew bow I've just finished with good pics of the back and how I handle it.
http://bowyersdiary.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/gripping-yarns.html
If you click on the pics to see 'em enlarged you will see at the ring boundaries the colour variation from the lighter to the darker, so to follow a ring back you are scraping away that lighter layer.
Your big problem is probably just rushing it. I seldom do more that about 30minutes on a back. Once you reach about 60, you'll fnd it easier to stop rushing
It's not a race.
BTW there is a wealth of info on my blog, the search facility works pretty well too. At risk of being immodest it's probably the best detailed illustated guide to making a Yew longbow if you can trawl through the info. It's certainly worth the admission price 
When working on bows always remove ony a half to 2/3 of what you think you should. It may make it slow, but but doing it quick and ruining it is slower in the long run.
Del

[WillS]

Have you got any pics Colin? What you might think is ruined might be fine when approached by experts like the guys on here.  Don't go scrapping it yet!!!!!

Post a few photos of where it went wrong and the whole stave and I bet there's a chance of getting a longbow out of it, whether it's laying in a bloom, patching, tempering or something else.

[Colindemo]

Hey Willis, you are just in time. I was just about to put the bow to the saw. I will post some pictures online tomorrow inclusiding a close up of the problem area's.

I've tried to pull the bow and what i found was that the bow wants to twist sideways in my hand when i do. I can see that the bow is slightly warped so i guess that could be the problem. I tried strapping my bow tightly to the rail on my balcony and warming it with my heatgun to straighten it out. I don't know how yew reacts to heating though so i don't want to heat it too much. It did seem to slightly reduce the warped shape but the bow still twists in my hand when i pull. Any ideas?

[WillS]

Without pics, it's almost impossible to tell.  Make sure you get them up as soon as you can, so people can guide you properly.

That being said, bows twisting is very common - either you've laid out the bow across the grain, and it's trying to bend with the grain as you draw it which makes life tricky, or you've simply removed slightly too much wood along one side, and you need to even it up to stop it twisting.  Or one side is denser, and you need to make the other side thinner (by a very small amount!) to prevent it twisting.

Yew responds very well to heat - if you're careful and slow and don't scorch the wood it will go like rubber eventually, letting you clamp it to a form and shape it how you want.  I wouldn't do that just yet though, as you may not need it. 

One thing I would recommend is going to Del's blog (google Del's Bows or Bowyers Diary) and using the search function on his blog look for "twist" - you'll find loads of pics and info on dealing with exactly what you're struggling with.

Other than that, get those pics up and the guys on here will help out as much as they can.

[Del the cat]

An English longbow can easily try to bend sideways on you because it's not much wider than it is thick... the last one I did tried to go S shaped on me big time. Read Bowyers diary from here.
http://bowyersdiary.blogspot.co.uk/2014/07/work-on-spliced-yew.html
The finished bow still has a hint of S shape, but the string line remains along the bow (see pic) .
You can see the pencil mark at the nock nearest camera, if the string is moved that way (by moving the nock across) and the nock at the other end is moved the other way, the string line is improved and the bow tips slightly re-shaped to improve it. Sometrimes just a little nock movement and easing off one edge of the bow is all that is needed. It's trick and subtle, but without doing it you have the horrible prospect of watching it bend sideays.
Also search for "sideways bend" it brings up some other posts with pictures and descriptions of how to fix it.
I've seen horrendous Yew longbows where someone has just kept going without correcting the problem and ended up with a bow that was bend more sideways than straight back.
Don't just scrap a bow, you won't learn how to solve the problems. keep at it even if you end up with a 20# bow or a pile of slinters, try to learn the most from each bow.
Todays blog shows Monkey Bow being reincarnated for the second time, having blown up twice! (Spliced limb tips breaking off!)
There is tons of stuff on heat treating in there too.
Del

[Colindemo]

Thx for all the info on your blog Del! One question though: is i want to remove the sideways bend, from which side do i remove wood? Lets say the sideways bend makes a c shape, do i remove wood from the inside of the c or the outside?  On the archery interchange site someone said the bow always bende away from the weaker side (in my example the outside of the c shape) but this seems counter intuïtive

[J05H]

Take a look at this thread. http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,27206.0.html

[Colindemo]

Oh lord, this link says the exact opposite  if this tread is to be believed the inside of the c is weakest which (imo) sounds more logical

[Colindemo]

Here are the pictures. As you can see most of the bend is just beyond the middle from this point of view. Unfortunately this is also the point where a slight hinge can be seen when drawn so i can't go removing to much wood there. The last two fotos are a sideview of the same area and as you can see, the heartwood on one side it almost all gone. I can remove sapwood there instead of the heartwood but i followed one growth ring along that bump and i figured the bow would have a weakspot there if i break that ring. I have played with the idea of adding horn to the belly of the middle area for about 7 inches so as to end up with a somewhat stiff handle. Any thoughts?

[Del the cat]

You have discovered the exact reason why following a ring isn't essential with Yew. The heartwood/sapwood boundary doesn't always follow a ring (you can see it in your photo 4). Don't remove all the heart wood, just take the sapwood down is a gentle blend, taking care to keep it smooth.
Regarding the sideways bend (that is what you are showing in pic 3 ) clamp it up with the bend taken out and a tiny bit of bend in the other direction and heat treat the belly hard (lots of time, not too hot too close too quick, which is the temptation) protect the back and the edges where the sapwood shows with loads of making tape etc. (spend at least half an hour wafting the heat gun over the last couple of foot of limb and leave it clamped until it's stone cold) The heat treating will also help stiffen up the hinge.
Don't narrow the tips further, and in future glue on an off cut of wood to make a temporary overlay with the nock groove cut in the back not the sides. This maximises you room for sideways adjustment in your string line and avoids cutting into the back of the limb..
I wish you'd spent a morning in my workshop with me, I could have got you going in the right direction and saved a bunch of heart ache... but hey we learn best and hardest from our own mistakes.
Persevere, there's a bow in there... maybe not the one you were aiming for, but there should be a bow!

Regarding the bend, it is easy to get confused, it is easy to missinterpret a simple statement like "remove wood from the stiff side". Does it mean from the side/edge? of the stiff side, or the thickness? or both?
There is a big difference between working on a wide flatish limb which will twist rather than bend sideways and a longbow limb which is almost square in proportion and doesn't much care which way it bends!
That's why I tend to move the stringline first.
If the limb is bending like a C then  the right edge is weak and the left stiff (Things bend towards the weak side) I would move the nocks to the left and ease off the THICKNESS of left edge of the belly.( Just like it says in that excellent post which JOSH linked to)

Moving the string line is always less drastic and easier to reverse, You can even glue a little slip of wood onto the side of the bow tip! A lot of adjustments/tricks/etc will be rasped away when a horn nock is fitted!
Del