80", 80# Ash warbow build along (low-budget style)

[WillS]

Interesting.  Never heard that or tried it.  Will give it a go next time! 

[Colindemo]

Another update, i've been busy today. Someone mentioned that before i heat treat the belly of the bow, I should first smear some honey on the belly of the bow. That way the sugar in the honey could soak into the wood and cristalize upon heating it. I used white spirit to help the honey soak into the wood and i'm going to let it sit overnight and heat treat it tomorrow. This is a totally new concept to me (it's called malming). I couldn't even find any info on it on this forum so i'm really curious how it will turn our, i'll find out tomorrow.

[WillS]

I like this thread,  I'm learning loads of new stuff from your process!

By the way, why are you heating the belly? Is the bow taking lots of set?  If not, heat treating isn't really necessary!

[Colindemo]

It has taken a reasonable amount of set while tillering already and i certainly don't want any more and hopefully this prevents it

I have finished the bow now and it draws about 70-80# on 30",  still need to weigh it accarately but i think i've come close to my target weight of about 80# on 31". I can't draw the bow to 31" at this point because my tillering jig isn't long enough. I have finished the bow with some beeswax and i will add some Danish oil later. The leather on the handle is just something i had laying around so that needs to be changed as well when i get some more and better leather.

For now, i'm really happy with the result and can't wait to try shooting it!

[Colindemo]

some pics

[WillS]

Very nice indeed! Well done mate.  Tips might be moving a bit much, giving you a slightly whip-ended tiller, but as long as they're not chrysalling, and you think you've avoided actual hinges then it should be ok.

Be careful using things like oil and wax on ash - they work great on woods like yew, but ash really loves to suck up moisture which will give you even more set than before!  Get a good modern finish on it like varnish to seal the moisture out, then you can dull the finish using beeswax if you want.  It's not traditional, but if you want it to last a long time and shoot as well as possible then you'll want to avoid it taking more set as a result of humidity etc.  Obviously if your goal is just to keep things as "primitive" as possible then avoid the modern finishes, but the bow will end up taking quite a lot of set if there is moisture in the air. 

When I was getting advice on making ash warbows from Jaro (pretty much the best there is when it comes to heavy ash bows) he told me to keep my hands constantly clean and dry as even sweat from your skin can affect an ash bow while working on it, and every time you take a break from tillering stick it on a radiator so it thoroughly dries out.  You don't need to do any of that with most other woods but ash really seems to hate getting wet!

Anyway, nice looking bow and I bet you can't wait to crack on with the next one!

P.S. Warbows don't have leather grips, just bare wood

[Colindemo]

Thx for the info! I did want it to be as traditional as possible so i refrained from using any type of modern finish. This bow is the first longbow i ever made so i don't expect it to shoot great nor do i expect that it's an exceptionally durable bow.

For my next bow i have a similar ash log standing ready and i will try to use your advice during the next bow-making process to hopefully and up with less set. Also, i'm thinking about adding some slight recurves to the tips but i will only do that when i have a new bow made so that when i break it i'll still have a bow to shoot with other than my flatbows.

p.s. I know about warbows not having a leather grip but i think it looks cooler and i had some laying around anyways so i thought: why not?

[WillS]

Well for your first longbow, to end up with a very reasonable tiller AND a draw weight around 80# is super impressive!  Well done dude, hope you enjoy shooting it!

[toomanyknots]

I think it looks pretty darn nice too!

[Micke D]

WillS - what about Elm, is it they same when it comes to sucking up moisture?

[WillS]

Dunno! Never had the chance to work with it!

[mikekeswick]

Ash doesn't 'suck up' moisture anymore than other woods....what it does do is take an awful long time to get very dry. It's like hickory in liking to be dry. I would suggest that an MC of 6 -8% is ideal. Plus unless you are working in somewhere with a very low r.h. the bow isn't likely to be aiming for an EMC of less than 10 -12%. So you have to do something anda hotbox etc between tillering is a very good idea.
It's well worth heat treating ash - it transforms it. The real coup de grace is trapping the back heavily. The reason ash takes so much set is that it's compression strength is nowhere near its tension strength. Go and do some bend tests one on a rectangular slat and one on a slat that has it's back trapped and belly heat treated. I found significant differences.

[Micke D]

@Mike - "The real coup de grace is trapping the back heavily". Can you please explain trapped/trapping?

[WillS]

Trapping is the process of chamfering the edges of the back so that the back of the bow itself is thinner than the bow.  Turns the bow sort of into a trapezoid shape, that you then round.

Mike, what about the really heavy bows made of ash that follow rough Mary Rose profiles, so no trapping at all?  Most of the top bowyers who are working with ash aren't heat treating, or trapping and turn out super heavy bows (well over 140#) that have almost no set (by which I mean around 0.5" to 1")

Is this down to different types/quality of ash, or is it skill as a bowyer or something else?  Perhaps it goes back to Del's question regarding the age of the ash tree (sapling/mature)?  I know that the ash I've worked with tends to be one or the other - either it wants to take a sack of set regardless how carefully I treat it, or it won't take any at all.  I don't like heat treating, and I don't like the look of a trapped back so I avoid both, and I have a selection of bows both with and without set.  Most of my ash staves come from a handful of trunks I selected about a year and a half ago, and I don't really know their age so maybe that's a deciding factor.

[OTDEAN]

Using different techniques defines someone who knows what to do I would say.  Not liking to heat treat 'EVER' just seems a bit odd.  I get the whole "I AM AN ENGLISH WAR BOW SOCIETY GUY LOOK AT MY MUSCLES RARRRRRRRRR I SHOOT HISTORICALLY ACCUARATE HEAVY WEIGHT LONGBOWS" but even Joe Gibbs has heat treated some of his bows because I have seen them. 

Ash is a great wood, sapling or mature, just use the right technique to get the best bow possible.  Go ahead, walk past the next Yew tree and hug an Ash, you know you want to!