Rules for center-shot arrow shelf in selfbow?

[PAHunter]

Sorry cool, I don't know the formula; just wanted to get my 2c in.    Sure shelf bows are not native American replicas but that's not everyone's goal or preference.  I think they can be functional and appealing and we shouldn't hate on personal preference.  Many people suggested this bow would break on me but I've since probably shot over 10,000 arrows through it.  good luck with it cool!

[cool_98_555]

PAHunter, that is a nice handle design you have there.  What is the draw weight on that bow?

[Josh B]

Hey cool.. here's some pics of my cut in shelf style.  I'm pressed for time right now, but if you'd like, I can explain the layout for you later this evening.  Josh

[blackhawk]

A few of mine,but not all of them


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=32310.0

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,36840.0.html

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=36133.0

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=36860.0

[PAHunter]

That one is only 53#.  I since have made them a bit thicker for safe measure.

[twisted hickory]

Hello again everyone and thank you for all the replies.  My arrow shelf doesn't need to be center-shot, but I just think it's nice to have one.  People keep saying that if you're going to cut an arrow shelf, make sure you "have enough wood in depth and behind the shelf" or the bow will break in the handle, but very few actually give dimensions of what is acceptable for the amount of wood that has to be there for it to be safe.  I have made bows in excess of 70lbs without a shelf for years, but the reason I want a shelf in a high draw weight bow is because I want to challenge myself and see if I can do it.  It would be nice to have a permanent place for the arrow to rest as well.  Problem is that I do have a really good stave that I am working with, and it is very straight with no knots, so perhaps i'll go with no shelf for the draw weight i'm looking for.  Perhaps I'll cut in arrow shelfs for lower draw weight bows, but i'm not sure yet.  There was a time when I made a 90# hickory backed white oak that I cut a shelf into.  Problem was that when I cut the shelf to center, I got back to 29" and it failed near the shelf.  That bow was 72" as well, so I guess you learn from your mistakes.  If I cut a shelf into this bow, it will probably not be quite center-shot or not have a shelf at all.  Also, since I really want to aim for 85# and I love the full compass tiller, perhaps it would be better to just do another "warbow-like" bow like I have done before where it bends in the handle.  Just not sure any more, haha!

Give it a shot. Be careful though as 85 lbs letting loose all of the sudden sounds like pain to me Let all of us know how it works.

[dmc]

A few of mine,but not all of them


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=32310.0

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,36840.0.html

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=36133.0

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=36860.0

Dang Blackhawk those are nice. Four bows over the holidays? You obviously don't have TV. Haha My approach for bow making seems to be that first I beat the idea to death with whoever I come in contact with, tell everyone I'm building a bow, pick up the wood three times a day to look at it, may even bring out a pencil to draw out some lines, put the wood back down not wanting to screw it up, find more people to tell, tell my idea to my poor wife for the zillionth time how good it's going to look, maybe even post pics of the uncut wood on face book. Check in the garage to look at my tiller tree and pulley system to see if anything has changed from the one bow I've made. I don't think I'll ever have the problem working on a bow that is green wood. It'll have wood rot or have fossiled by the time I'm ready. I have two hickory staves, and some bamboo /Ipe appreciating in my basement as I speak. Hmmmm.......maybe should go have a look at them . AGAIN!!

[artcher1]

If you think real hard about it, primitive man didn't build primitive bows. He built state of the art equipment that was as efficient as possible for his time. So cutting a shelf in is just another way to make things that much more efficient.

An 1 1/4" width is pretty common for Osage bows between 50-70# depending on the density of the wood, but for the weight you're wanting,  I'd go at a minimum of 1 1/2" for the width and 66-68" for the length. I would want to leave at a minimum 3/4" of wood at the arrow pass/window for that weight. Maybe 1 3/4" handle depth. Go for it. Good luck..........Art B

[DuBois]

If you tiller as bad as I do you can get center shot with no shelf at all 

[cool_98_555]

Thank you to everyone who has replied to this topic!  I had no idea I would get such great replies, so thank you everyone.  You know it's funny....originally I had planned on making the bow 1.5" wide at the fades, but it was recommended that I go 1 3/8" (because osage can take it, and because this particular piece of osage is almost as good as you can get for osage, so I can afford to go a bit narrower).  I'll have to choose between those two.  I feel more comfortable with 1.5", but since I am leaving the handle area nice and thick and i'm starting with 3/4" thick parallel limbs out to the tips (from the fades), I think 1 3/8" should be fine.  I might find that when I get to the end I might not want to go for a shelf...I guess it depends on how I feel at the end of the tillering.

Yea if you guys have dimensions for your bows with cut-in shelves I would really appreciate that!

[mikekeswick]

as has been said you DO NOT need any sort of shelf and doing so will seriously weaken your bow. To be able to cut a big shelf out then the handle has to be deep. Deep handles are way more prone to torquing when shot.
All these 'inventions' are ways of making archery easier and easier and easier. A shelf is just the same mentality as sights, stabalisers etc etc. Whats wrong with it requiring skill and dedication  after all these things are what make challenges rewarding.
Sorry for the rant 

That's a bit of an assumption there.  I've made 100's of bows that are close to centre shot and never had one fail including 80#+ recurves.

I didn't say it couldn't be done  Of course it's possible to make any draw weight bow with a centershot handle.
What I meant was that if the handle area hasn't been designed with doing this from the start it isn't the best idea to cut into what I would call a 'standard depth handle' on a selfbow to make it centershot.
My sentiment was that it just isn't necessary to do it in the first place but the world would be a boring place if we all thought the same