Author Topic: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.  (Read 6066 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline SLIMBOB

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,759
  • Deplorable Slim
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2012, 07:14:40 pm »
I don't doubt their age.  I question whether or not they are arrow or spear points.  Could be, but that would make them much older than anything previously found.  Could be that they were fragments from stones used for fleshing or cutting.  I'm open to the possibility, just skeptical.  As far as, "science does not have to be believed to be right".  No, it doesn't, but it has to be right, to be right, not just believed.
Liberty, In God We Trust, E Pluribus Unum.  Distinctly American Values.

Offline PatM

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,737
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2012, 08:12:55 pm »
everything returns to dust sooner or later.....its that simple....even for scientists!!       >:D
Yes, but apparently "later" is much longer than people think.
 If an Egyptian tomb was unearthed 60000 years from now, the objects in it would be closer to dust than they are now but still identifiable for what they are.
 We're not talking about an arrowhead left out in the weather to be cleaned but rather the equivalent of a landfill where things can be dug up practically unchanged.

Offline loefflerchuck

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,126
    • www.heartwoodbows.com
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #17 on: November 24, 2012, 09:18:53 pm »
With stone like obsidian they date by the coating that forms over the worked edges. They can also tell where it was quarried. Thes dating method is accurate but as far as I know only works on obsidian.

Offline dragonman

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,142
    • virabows.co.uk
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2012, 11:14:26 am »
even a really dumb guy could manage to get a better point on a piece of flint than these, even a rough flake would work better  than these rocks. We can assume any one smart enough to make a bow and twist fibres to make a string, then make arrows and attach points, is smart enough to use a sharp piece of flint. So I doubt these scientists who have probably made nothing at all, not a bow, string, arrow or a point. really know what they are on about.......just my humble opinion

Also, how  can you agree with the age if you doubt they are arrowheads??? if they arent arrowheads they are just rocks, then they are millions of years old
'expansion and compression'.. the secret of life is to balance these two opposing forces.......

Offline Tortoise

  • Member
  • Posts: 162
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2012, 11:35:45 am »
Either way, those are some of the ugliest points I've ever seen  :laugh:
-Peter
Arizona

Offline Josh Shuck

  • Member
  • Posts: 57
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #20 on: November 25, 2012, 12:00:01 pm »
I gotta say, I think the story was pretty cool!  Imagining a band of hunter gathers crudely smashing rocks together and crudely attaching them to crude bows and arrows is exactly what I would imagine and is probably exactly what I would do if I got dropped off in the wilderness with nothing but my hands and brain to survive.

There are blood and bone remains on the points still...really!  There are pictures, the proof , in the story.  They can test using radio carbon dating.  Which measures the known half life of naturally occurring radio isotopes and get a margin of error of like 50 years.  Science has been doing this now for a long time with good results.  Even a margin of 200 or 300 years is very close when we are talking this many thousands of years ago.

Yes they are crude but I think people are imaging Neolithic style points which was the pinnacle of arrowhead refinement.  The Neolithic age was about 10,000 years ago.... That gives 54,000 years of refinement!!!  Honestly they don't look too much different when I tried flint knapping.  I quickly said forget it and bought some for $10 bucks a peice.  Flint knapping is a very delicate and skilled operation.  I had a book and good tools even...this guy had a couple of rocks and a camp fire.   I'll give him credit though... Obviously they worked!  Proof if is in the puddin' 64,000 years later. 

And I'm sure the professor has heard of a bow and arrow before given the focus of her research.  This was taken from her universities website:

"Her main research interest is ancient cognition and her experimental archaeology is geared towards understanding the mental architecture required for various behaviours. Her most recent work is on the production and use of compound adhesives and the implications this has for cognition."



Offline Pat B

  • Administrator
  • Member
  • Posts: 37,543
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #21 on: November 25, 2012, 12:13:03 pm »
Are these "points" only portions of points or are they the complete point? It is hard to tell from a single picture. If we could study each one of these artifacts we should be able to see where they were worked by other than natural phenomena.
  Until Otzi was found we thought that the Bronze Age happened much later than it did. Why is it not possible that humanoids had "bows and arrows" before we thought it were possible. All of the materials used to make bows and arrows are biodegradable. Stone, being slow to degrade last many times longer than the other components so the stone tools are all we have to go by. We have to theorize the rest. Humans have been using tools since early on in our evolution, many millions of years ago. Why then is it not possible that bows and arrows come about in history long before we thought they did?
 
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline dragonman

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,142
    • virabows.co.uk
Re: 70 thousand year old arrowheads found in Africa.
« Reply #22 on: November 25, 2012, 12:25:22 pm »
I agree Pat, I dont have a problem accepting humans had bows and arrows even 100.000 yrs ago, I think they (archeologists etc) actually have some artifacts this old. 
 Josh,,It took me a day the first time I tried, messing around with flints and hammer stones and I had a few basic sharp pointed arrowheads, its not that hard.

Its still a cool story though,  I just dont trust scientists...perhaps thats why I'm on the PA?
'expansion and compression'.. the secret of life is to balance these two opposing forces.......