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Author Topic: Eliminating stack  (Read 12809 times)

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Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2012, 11:03:41 am »
Quote from: Pappy on August 29, 2012, 06:21:26 am
Question Pearl  ??? every shot a long bow say 66/68 long that stacked,well I have and with my meager draw length 26 on a good day  ;)I couldn't have been anywhere near 90 degree on the string,so to say that is the ONLY thing that will cause one to stack is not exactly right. Yes 90 degree angle on the string will cause it but other factors can come into play  also. A wip end bow will stack,yes because of the angle but there are things you can do to help it in the tiller,that's why I wanted to see the bow at full draw. Early draw weight/good even weight gain and angle of string less than 90  and you will have a smooth drawing bow. ;) :) :)
   Pappy

No I havent. Stack and a crappy force draw curve are two totally different things in my mind. I thought Del's reference was a good desrciption that explained the other side of a crappy drawing bow.
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Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2012, 11:21:29 am »
Quote from: Pappy on August 29, 2012, 06:21:26 am
Question Pearl  ??? every shot a long bow say 66/68 long that stacked,well I have and with my meager draw length 26 on a good day  ;)I couldn't have been anywhere near 90 degree on the string,so to say that is the ONLY thing that will cause one to stack is not exactly right. Yes 90 degree angle on the string will cause it but other factors can come into play  also. A wip end bow will stack,yes because of the angle but there are things you can do to help it in the tiller,that's why I wanted to see the bow at full draw. Early draw weight/good even weight gain and angle of string less than 90  and you will have a smooth drawing bow. ;) :) :)
   Pappy

Yall need to listen to this guy. (Btw, I have shot many longbows that have stacked... ...all of them I have made,  ;D. Mostly they stacked I believe from having a very non-working middle section of the bow, as well as a couple being 1/2" or so deflexed from the start?...)
« Last Edit: August 29, 2012, 11:57:35 am by toomanyknots »
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"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2012, 11:48:06 am »
Fine you got me. Anytime a bow doesnt pull smoothly its stacking. Got it now.
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Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2012, 12:01:59 pm »
Quote from: PEARL DRUMS on August 29, 2012, 11:03:41 am
Stack and a crappy force draw curve are two totally different things in my mind.

?
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"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2012, 12:10:19 pm »
The poorly tillered bows of yours that you spoke off have a nasty force draw curve because of the stiff fades you referenced. Stacking is not simply a bow that is mushy the first 18-20" then turns into a 60# draw the last few inches because the fades start working. Stacking occurs when the limb stops bending and starts pullling. That why we say draw length x 2 is the minumum length a bow can be to avoid stacking. 

 
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Offline Pappy

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2012, 12:29:18 pm »
I guess we will have to agree to disagree, stacking in my mine is when a bow loads up all at once anywhere during the draw,including he last inch or 2. But you know how oppions are,everybodys got one. ;) ;D Didn't mean to rock the boat just have my own thoughts on stack and thought I would share. ;D Same with set and string follow and I could go on and on.Learned on my own and don't do much reading,Maybe I should.  :-\
   Pappy
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Offline boughnut

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #21 on: August 29, 2012, 12:31:15 pm »
My experience with it is string angle.  Everything said here seems to point to that.  even the whip limb designs stacks due to string angle.  But I agree with some flipping the tips on a whipped limb bow is not the best rout I would get the fades moving then flip the tips if necessary to pick up draw weight.
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Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #22 on: August 29, 2012, 12:48:27 pm »
Quote from: Pappy on August 29, 2012, 12:29:18 pm
I guess we will have to agree to disagree, stacking in my mine is when a bow loads up all at once anywhere during the draw,including he last inch or 2. But you know how oppions are,everybodys got one. ;) ;D Didn't mean to rock the boat just have my own thoughts on stack and thought I would share. ;D Same with set and string follow and I could go on and on.Learned on my own and don't do much reading,Maybe I should.  :-\
   Pappy

Im just an indepent thinker and bullheaded as they come Pappy. Hell I didnt even buy the bowyers bibles until I made 30 or so bows, figured they werent gonna tell me anything I cant learn on my own by screwing up enough.........thats bullheaded!
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Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.

Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #23 on: August 29, 2012, 12:59:50 pm »
Quote from: PEARL DRUMS on August 29, 2012, 12:10:19 pm
The poorly tillered bows of yours that you spoke off have a nasty force draw curve because of the stiff fades you referenced.

All of these bows were around 74" - 76" long so string angle would be no where near 90 degrees at my normal 26" draw. There are more factors than just string angle, a good deal of which I believe have been stated and explained to some degree in this thread. I see no point in arguing with anyone who has already made up their mind though.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2012, 01:31:07 pm by toomanyknots »
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"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

Offline SLIMBOB

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #24 on: August 29, 2012, 05:13:56 pm »
Gotta say it's string angle.  Some have argued that there are other factors but none have articulated what those factors are.  If not string angle alone, then what else?  I'm not sure the concept of "string angle past 90 degrees" answers the question of stack to begin with. A is followed by B so A caused B???
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blackhawk

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #25 on: August 29, 2012, 05:36:46 pm »
Quote from: Pappy on August 29, 2012, 12:29:18 pm
I guess we will have to agree to disagree, stacking in my mine is when a bow loads up all at once anywhere during the draw,including he last inch or 2. But you know how oppions are,everybodys got one. ;) ;D Didn't mean to rock the boat just have my own thoughts
   Pappy

Lyrics from a Bob Marley song..."oh please don't you rock my boat..don't rock my boat...cus I don't want my boat,to be rocking....don't rock my boat".....way to go Pappy  ;)...lol

And no further comments from me :P
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Offline George Tsoukalas

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #26 on: August 29, 2012, 05:38:36 pm »
How was you walk, Pappy? I think we'll just let the young'uns figure this one on their own. Pappy and I waited for about 10-30 bows too because the TBB's were not out yet. :) Jawge
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Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #27 on: August 29, 2012, 05:54:27 pm »
Ill just rest on my rack full of stack-less bows, for whatever reason they are stackless.
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Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.

Offline toomanyknots

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #28 on: August 29, 2012, 07:59:20 pm »
Two quotes from pearl drums in the exact same thread:

Quote from: PEARL DRUMS on August 29, 2012, 11:03:41 am
Stack and a crappy force draw curve are two totally different things in my mind.

Quote from pearl drums shortly after, when referring to some longbows I said that stacked:

Quote from: PEARL DRUMS on August 29, 2012, 12:10:19 pm
The poorly tillered bows of yours that you spoke off have a nasty force draw curve because of the stiff fades you referenced.


  ???...       ;D
« Last Edit: August 29, 2012, 09:11:13 pm by toomanyknots »
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"The way of heaven is like the bending of a bow-
 the upper part is pressed down,
 the lower part is raised up,
 the part that has too much is reduced,
 the part that has too little is increased."

- Tao Te Ching, 77, A new translation by Victor H. Mair

Offline boughnut

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Re: Eliminating stack
« Reply #29 on: August 29, 2012, 10:07:37 pm »
to get back on subject has the young fella came up with a solution?  Some pics of your bow would help.
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