will Ipe make a recurve?

[Prarie Bowyer]

Even if it's segmented and laminated?

[Justin Snyder]

Yes

[Prarie Bowyer]

I just found pics of a guy that is dong a segmented on recurve tips.  Bowskin Archery. 

I was thinking of using the heat bend method  with 3-4 laminations of other woods as well.  Or splicing flipped tips on like Syahs.  He glues them on top of the back under the backing of the bow.  Interesting idea.

[Justin Snyder]

I think kerf cuts are the only way to make it happen. I made one a few years ago, by kerfing then heating, you can read more about it and see pictures here. About half way down the second page is where I describe the process a little. http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,7923.15.html

[mikekeswick]

Cutting kerfs is the way to go. Ipe isn't great when heat bending. Make it thin enough and you will have no problems.

[Prarie Bowyer]

I think kerf cuts are the only way to make it happen. I made one a few years ago, by kerfing then heating, you can read more about it and see pictures here. About half way down the second page is where I describe the process a little. http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,7923.15.html

Justin I award you Clever fellow of the month award!   That is awesome.

I was thinking something like this.
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,26965.0.html

But I think I like what you did better.  Question.  How did you clean up the seam on the inside?  Please dont say 42 hours with 100 grit sand paper wrapped around an old hacksaw blade.  Oh wait did you hand saw it?  I have a band saw that I use prodigiously.  Love it.  Good with it.  Love the thin kerfs.

Could that have been done with a mid section that is flexed out slightly to create a gull wing sort of effect?  You think steam is essential for the kerf cut bend?

[Justin Snyder]

I made the kerf cuts with my band saw. I did fold a piece of sandpaper in the middle to sand a little, (very little) but I don't think it is that crucial. A band saw makes a pretty clean cut and many people like to rough the surface up a little with a toothing plane before they glue anyway. I think you could use any profile you want midlimb without any ill effects.

I am quite sure the steam isn't essential for larger radius curves, but I think it was beneficial for these small ones. It takes a lot of force to bend into tight curves. I think without steaming it would have forced all of the glue out of the joint when it was bent which would be fatal to the bow.

I plan to make another one of these, only slightly longer for a hunting bow. It will be either straight or have a slight reflexed profile. I will cut several kerfs and steam it before I glue the recurves.

[PatM]

Just recurve pieces of easily bent wood and splice them in. Arguably easier than kerfing.
I  do this all the time with massa and ipe recurves using Elm for the tips.

[Prarie Bowyer]

Just recurve pieces of easily bent wood and splice them in. Arguably easier than kerfing.
I  do this all the time with massa and ipe recurves using Elm for the tips.

Pat. Have any pics of how it looks?  You are talking about a Horse bow type splice?

[Prarie Bowyer]

Ok.  Here is the plan.  That is what I need first.  A plan of action.  I'm going to do a tri lam.  I like those and I have faith in the glue lines.
Bamboo backing
Hickory core lam.  3/16 ish or less tapered to the tip.  Taper of  1/16" from riser to the tip.
Belly piece.  No idea how thick to make this.  I'm guessing NOT THAT THICK.  Ipe is hard stuff and seems to pile on rigidity.  3/8" at the thickest.  Possibly less.
Kerf cut 6.5"  and do a curved hickory insert.  Also a curved belly overlay that will give a static recurve.  I like the profile of the the ones PatM did with his bendy handle static recurves.  I'll aim for that.  Also the "Snow White and the Huntsman" previews show a pretty cool bow.

Radius will be possibly a porabola.  Tightest will be say 5 gal bucket.  I have those forms from my failed Eucalyptus recurves.  May just make new simpler ones.  Dig that profile of Gordons Yew bow.

Length will be 58" ?  Or possibly 60"  so far by shortest bow is a reflexed 66" bow.  maybee 62" for this one.   

Limb width at the fades will be .... hmmm.. 1.5" to start.  Straight taper for Err... 5"-6"  then taper to 1/2" tips?  I'll give it Ebony nock tips or ebony and bone.  Possibly an bone arrow pass ELB style also.

yea Ok so I have a plan.  I'll just read it through before cutting wood.   Assemble the bow in my head 30 times before actualy doing it.  Toss and turn tonight dreaming about broken and backwards bows and probably a visit from the bow police.  Tomorrow I'll cut the blanks.  Procrastinating of course the point of no return cuts.

Steps:
Prep the bamboo backing. I use a jack plane to scrub down to flat wood.   Band saw the blank.to shape.  Clean up with belt sander and check alignments and such.  Use it to trace the profile on the Hickory core lam and the bamboo.  Grind the core lam to thickness and then retrace the profile.  Stare at all parts for about 40 min while talking to myself.  Look like crazy guy to passers buy as I talk to wood.  Cut the hickory piece becasue it could still be used in a R/D which I know what I'm doing on. 

look at my plan for recurving the tips.  Tinker with trying to glue it all crown up in one shot on my normal glue stick. 
     - If I do that I'd need to make new recurving jigs.  The opposite side from what most of you guys use.  Screw that to my straight bar and mark a center line on it.   Put holes for clamps and pegs for rubbers on it.  Possibly use the other side to prebend some of the parts with heat.

Sand bamboo down to 1/16 thickness or so and make sure it's flat from end to end.  Groove it. Groove the hickory piece.  Grove the Ipe.  Realize I forgot to make the kerf cuts.  Stare at them for 40 min praying.  Make the cuts.  Cut belly slices off.  Sand the belly free of saw marks.  Test how it goes into the form with out heat.  If it goes then no need for heat prebending the Ipe.

Get things prebent and fitting close.  Including all wedges and such.  Mix up the glue and go to town with assembly.  I've found that time in the hot box makes bows suck down to the form if using the Rubber clamps.

Set to cook for 4 hours and leave for a few days strapped up in the form.  Unwrap, grind excess glue off and start building a bow. 

There I thought it through.  What could possibly go wrong?  (it took me 4 ELB's to come close to something that looks ELBish)

[Justin Snyder]

You forgot to degrease the ipe before glue up. 
I dont think you are going to need kerf cuts if you go trilam. The pieces will already be really thin and you might blow out of the cuts so practice on another piece first if you are going to do them.

[Prarie Bowyer]

Nice build along.  I didn't catch what that red wood was.

[mikekeswick]

Also don't groove laminations - no need. Seriously if you want repeatable curves etc go with kerfs. I make laminated recurves and have done quite a few it's definately the best way - i've tried pretty much ever method you can think of. I also wouldn't use bands on the recurve sections - make a reverse form then clamp on top.