Black Locust ringchasing (newbee questions)

[Henrik]

Hey all.

I'm very new to this hobby, only made a simple oak board bow that I snapped during a way to enthusiastic tillering.

Here in Denmark I luckily have access to Black Locust staves already split in quarters from a local lumberyard. Knowing more or less nothing about what to look for I purchased 4 staves and have been working on one of them removing the sapwood.

I made sure to look for somewhat straight staves, with as few knots as possible. I am afraid that I did not pay enough notice to the growth ring patterns. just below the 1/4" sapwood the rings are very densely packed, making ring chasing a very difficult process I think. 

Is this a stave that should be backed or does it not matter much when the rings are so close together if I violate one or two rings? Or is it more a question of patience and practice on my side to get one of the 0,5 mm (app 0,02 inches) thick rings across the stave?

Another thing, the last foot or so of the stave have a slight bend in it. (pic included) should I just cut the stave down at this point? or is it possible to make a nice bow out of the stave as is?

By the way, my only current option for backing material is bamboo. and I have heard that Boo and locust don't play well together, is this true? and if so would it still be possible using a very thin and tapered boo backing?

[Henrik]

the two pics of the end is on the thick end. The top 1/5 of the stave looks like one large ring due to my poor camera, but it is really more like 11-12 rings there (app 1/2 inch)

[Pat B]

Like most woods you need to get a good back ring with locust also. If the rings are too thin to do this you should back it. I would opt for rawhide, linen or silk bor backing. I believe boo would be too much for the locust being that you are a new bowyer.

[Henrik]

Hmm thought as much

currently my glue of choice is an expanding PU glue. (Titebond does not exist here in dk) If I want to back using silk or linen can I use a water based carpenters glue (for outdoors use) or does it have to be some nasty chemicals or hide glues (since I work out of my 1-bedroom appartment I really don't have the option of using hide glue due to the smell etc.)

[Pat B]

Any water based carpenters glue should work. Some of my first backings were done with Elmer's glue and cheap white school glue.
  You will want the silk to be saturated with glue once down so the glue and cloth become one, similar to fiberglass resin and cloth. First you get the silk wet, wring out the excess water and add glue to the silk(called sizing) then add glue to the back of the bow and lay the cloth down. I like to do one limb at a time and overlap at the handle. If the cloth is limp enough it may drape nicely over the limb. In a case like this I don't use a wrap to secure it. After the glue has started to set(not too much) I work out each limb with my thumb or fingers to get the air pockets out and the excess glue pockets out and let it begin to cure. After about an hour or so but before the glue has gotten hard is when I trim most of the excess cloth off.   If the silk is stiffer you may have to wrap it after you put it down. I use strips of old bed sheets for this. Again before it gets too hard, remove the wrap and trim the excess cloth off. Check now to be sure there are no air or glue pockets under the silk. If you can't work them out with a finger you can use a sharp razor and cut a small slit, lengthwise in the silk to release it.
  After a few days of curing usa a smooth file to smooth and even up the edges if the silk.  The back of your bow is now a perfect pallet for artwork or decorations.

[Henrik]

Hi Pat.

Thank you for this great reply

I think I'll try to get a ring throughout the stave first, and if this won't succeed then Ill back it with silk for sure

Does anyone have any advice on the narrower end of the stave, without this bit I should be able to make a 60-62 inch bow and as stated before the bit itself is just over a foot long (See the first two pictures)

[Marc St Louis]

I have made a few Bamboo backed BL bows and none chrysaled.  BL is strong in tension so it usually doesn't need to be backed.

[Henrik]

Is it possible to apply something to the back that makes it easier to distinguish the individual rings, oil or something? or is it just a question of a keen eye and proper lighting?

[JW_Halverson]

The early wood in black locust is much like osage and mulberry....very porous!  Those pores are used by the tree to draw moisture up from the roots by capillary action, and THAT is somethingyou can use in your favor.  A quick wipe with stain on a rag will cause the early wood to suck up stain.  Have a clean, dry rag handy and make another quick wipe across the wood to wipe away most of the stain.  Your late wood will wipe mostly clean.  The early wood should then be very plain to see. 

At first it is very hard to train your eye to see the difference between early and late wood.  I know I used to havew great difficulty with this.  Now I just seem to "smell" it.  My drawknife runs itself without me even having to watch all that closely.  If you have to use a little stain to find it, that's quite ok with me.  Nothing is cheating until you have to use fiberglass!