White Ash stave at low brace height -- Questions

[Canoe]

Howdy Group,

Well, I'm movin' forward on this White Ash stave bow.  But, I have questions...

1)  At low brace height, I measured it to be 25# @18". I'm sure I could pull it farther, but that's all I've gotten it to for now.  So, did I miss my target poundage of 52# @ 27"?  And, is there an easy way for me to figure this out on my own?  (I could take a few inches off each end.  Would that bring me into range?)

2)  This stave has a few problems on its back.  So, I intend to back it with rawhide.  At what point is the right time to back a stave?

As always, thanks for your insightful guidance,
Canoe

[Del the cat]

Getting to low brace is about 80% of the work.
I'd say you should have been pulling it to nearer the final weight all the way through the proces... ok maybe not full target but at least 75%.
Bottom line is if you are aiming for 52# @ 27" you've got to pull it to 52#  or to 27" at some point. I know it's nerve wracking, but if tou think the tille ris looking good, then bring it back another inch and check the weight and tiller... if it's still good repeat the process, stop if you hit a) 52# b) 27" c) it goes BANG.
Fingers crossed it's not c)
Good luck
Del
PS. You could do some fancy arithmetic based on 2# per inch or whatever... but all the arithmetic in the world won't effect the reality!
Once you have it back to 27" if the weight is low you can then worry about shortening it, fliping the tips or whatever... bottom line is still you've got to pull it back to 27" sometime.

[Canoe]

Howdy Del,

Thanks, I will proceed with caution.
 

And, what about the backing question?  I'm guessing it's to early to consider backing it at this point. (?)

[Pat B]

It's never too early to back with rawhide and the only time it is too late is if the bow has already broken.     If you want to do any heat treating wait until after that to back with rawhide.
  If your limbs are bending well pull the bow slowly to your desired weight and note the draw length(unless over 27"). I usually figure 2# to 3# per inch to get me in the ball park....but, no matter if you hit weight or not complete the bow. There are a few options that can increase draw weight but the tiller must be good for any of them to work.

[JW_Halverson]

Del once advised someone to pull it until it breaks then back off a tad!

Pat has a great point.  I've backed a stave shortly after pulling off the bark when it was wringing wet just to see if it would prevent the back from checking.  I used hide glue and it got moldy.  So I guess I proved him wrong about it never being too early!!!   

If you are concerned about the bow coming in lower in draw weight than you can live with, maybe you should wait until it is close to final tiller before applying the rawhide.  That way if it is too light you can save the rawhide for the inevitable next project.

Hang in there, we're all pulling for you.

[Canoe]

Howdy Group,

I'll be heading back out there to do some more damage scraping, I'm really excited about the thought of building a good huntin' bow from this stave.

Thanks for pullin' for me,
Canoe

[Canoe]

Howdy Group,

Well I grit my teeth and slowly pulled it out to 27". 

It's coming in at 34#@27".  (Way too low )  (Was shooting for 52@27.)

The over all length of this stave is 70-1/2" long, so I could stand to cut some length off of it if were worth my trouble. (?) 

So, what do you all think, should I set this one into the corner and move onto my next stave?  Or, should I go ahead and try to rescue this one.

I could cut it off and, as Pat said, go ahead and re curve this one to increase the poundage?

What do you think?,
Canoe

[Pat B]

Trying to make one work usually doesn't work out as well as you wished it would. For now, set this one aside and start your next one. Later, come back to this first one and finish it and give it to your wife, girl friend or a neighbor kid.

[Canoe]

Howdy Pat and Group,

Yeah, I'll set this one aside and move on to the next stave (or board).  I have eight or nine staves all roughed out and waiting for some attention, I'll just grab another one and have at it  --  with lessons learned.

Thanks much all,
Canoe

[Buckeye Guy]

I would like some pictures first but right now I vote cut it down and heat in some reflex !
Still a lot to learn from this piece of wood
Guy

[Marc St Louis]

If your tiller is good then you can certainly cut some off the length especially if you back with rawhide. 

[Hrothgar]

Canoe,
Pat's advice about setting this one aside for awhile and starting another one is good. I was wondering what your design is for this bow? ELB, flatbow, or what; also, did you let the wood dry out completely? I guess I'm curious that the weight at 27" isn't heavier.
Eric

[adb]

Regardless of backing type, I always back a bow before I start tillering it.

[johnston]

Ok , I am a little confused so somebody straighten me out. Canoe you said this stave is 70 1/2 " I believe. Some said put it aside some said pike it so which is it?

My opinion...keep a close eye on tiller, go slow and cut it down ever how much the wood will stand or until you hit weight. Then back it.

I also don't believe in pulling too hard til the tiller and the weight are close to target. If enough wood is left during the floor tillering you can creep up on the weight you want and never come in light unless the wood gives of course.  But that's just me.
 So Canoe, what you gonna do?

Lane

[PEARL DRUMS]

I have found that if Im not at least 45# @ 20" I will never make the usual 50-60# @ 28" bow after sanding and shooting in, thats at full brace and properly tillered. Im with Marc on this one, snip off at least 1 1/2" per end. Thats alot of bow for 27", even unbacked. If you put some rawhide on the back I would nip that sucker right down to 62-64" ttt and you will have all the draw weight you want.