thanks guys. always got honey, outa milk but i have hundreds of bow thickets around , next time i wont split a sapling, the knots on one side leave a hollow spot on the other stave. not enough wood on either one. it allready twisted 90 degrees. i was excited about a rare hickory snake and didnt think it thru. gee, we heat the house with wood (4ricks) so i found the silver linning on this one. thanks again, butch