ENclonghunter I can really identify with you on the assult thing. When you know that about your points that is when things start to change. My next goal is to calm down the stone earlier so that I can establish a better flake pattern. I used pencil lines running the Length of the point to see if a flake was reacting correctly based on a particular technique. I actually was amazed by how things work out when I follow a set of rules so to speak. Hey leapingbear I wanted to tell you that I read a post where you punched out stalled notches and it worked almost too good. I removed a huge flake form the back side with a punch, have to take small bites with that technique. I will have to post a picture of that one next.