Black Locust rings

[Cacatch]

For those who have dealt with Black Locust much...

I recently cut a BL tree that was about 18" diameter. It was leaning when I cut it, but otherwise looked reasonably healthy. Of course this time of year there were no leaves on it to see if they looked healthy or not. But after cutting it, I looked at the rings and some of the outter ones are extremely close together and very hard to discern. Some of the inner rings are plenty thick, but the earlywood layer between them is thick too. Thicker than on most other locust logs I have dealt with. Anybody know if this is bad? Has anyone ever made a bow from a BL tree that had thick earlywood rings? I don't have a pick just yet.

CP

[jonathan creason]

Thick growth rings on a tree just means that the tree was growing rapidly during that time frame.  I'm not much of a bowyer, but it seems from what I've read that most prefer a slower growing tree with more rings per inch for the best bows, but I wouldn't let that stop me.

[Cacatch]

Thank for your reply, Jonathan. I went in and revised my initial post. My question is really more about the earlywood/latewood ratio. Some of the earlywood rings are thicker than I'm used to working with. The ratio is still about 1:1 or 1:2 in some spots but I'm concerned if thicker earlywood rings indicate poorer quality wood generally.

CP

[Buckeye Guy]

Speaking in generalities the larger the early groth rings the poorer the performace !

[gmc]

BL is quite the challenge for the beginner, was for me, anyway. I built a bunch of bows before ever working with the stuff and failed twice before I found good quality wood and how to treat it. You really have to be careful when you split BL because it tends to split back under itself leaving you scratching your head with that hollow noise produced by the scrapper. It also likes to propeller twist just to make things interesting and will leave you with a fret for good luck at the end if not tillered properly. Or so they say.

BL will also vary a lot in density, within the tree, tree to tree and location. Far as ring growth, good luck with trying to figure this one out. It takes building a lot of bows to get the first hint. This could be better shown than explained here, but BL will shoot early wood growth into the late wood. If you look real close you will see it, these trees make better firewood. A well defined distinction between the two, thinner ringed, feeling like lead when you pick it up makes the best bows you've ever held. The ratio of early to late wood I'm not so worried about in Locust if the density and definition is there.  

Just for the record, you will find the density increases the deeper you travel into the stave. Remove the sapwood when possible.

Hope this helps.

[Sparrow]

Man 18" log.Wide flat back on a bow. Split that sucker up,de-bark,seal the ends and put it away for a couple of years.I am working on a BL stave right now. I went in three rings and stopped on a thick late wood ring. This is the 3rd stave off a tree I cut back in 1997. I gave the other two away and they are still shooting those bows. This is good wood. Take your time and play by the rules and you should get good bows. It is very pretty wood too.  '  Frank

[Cacatch]

Thanks for the advice, guys. I have a sneaking suspicion that this tree was dying from something and that's why it was leaning over. I think I know what GMC meant about "shooting earlywood growth into the latewood" and this log has it. I have also seen BL where the earlywood was thinner and in those trees the distinction was a lot clearer and way more defined. I think I'll just try to work down to a thick latewood ring and bang a couple out. If they're good, they're good and if not, they'll keep me warm fishing this spring.

Thanks again. I'll let you guys know how they turn out. 

CP

[Pappy]

Not sure on Black Locust,I have made a few but none were like that,but I do know with Osage a ratio like that is fire wood in my opinion. You could give it a try and it may work for a lighter weight bow. Some say it good to practice on but as for me I want to know[in most cases] if it fails it because of me ,not poor wood.
   Pappy

[Cacatch]

Pappy,

Yeah, I agree. I've toyed with Osage that had pretty much these same characteristics once, made 3 bows from it which should have been decent if not good, and all 3 broke. One of them was even sinew backed and cracked under the sinew! That particular hedge tree had blown over when hurricane winds blew through Indiana back in 2008 if I remember right. I don't like to use leaning or blown down wood, especially when it has earlywood like this. But it was such a good haul though otherwise. I have three 7-foot logs all at least 12" in diameter cut from it and all 3 are mostly straight with few if any knots.  And BL is one of, if not my favorite bow wood. I just can't bare to chop it all up and burn it without trying first.

CP

[crooketarrow]

    I made a couple just like that. With the rings were so close. A strong 32 th I just used the first ring under the sap wood.  All 3 were good bows. I made quite a few BL bows with 1/8 rings or better.  I think hese made great bows.
 BL is a cousin to osage.