Author Topic: sioux arrows!  (Read 14273 times)

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Offline LEGIONNAIRE

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sioux arrows!
« on: September 07, 2010, 02:58:28 am »
Quick question on plains arrows. I know the bows did not have particularly long draws 20-24 and the arrows where not to long and spine did not have much of an effect because they shot short range. How thick were the shafts, from my book it says 5/16 but I might of heard somewhere some were up to 3/8ths if so where these tappered shafts? if tappered, was the thicker end foward? oops not a quick one. any help appreciate it.
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Offline mullet

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2010, 10:26:28 pm »
 Maybe Mr. Jackcrafty will come on. He's made numerous, authenic plains arrows.
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Offline Pat B

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2010, 10:58:11 pm »
Jackcrafty(Patrick) has a few "build alongs" in the "how to" section, making primitive arrows and mostly plains style.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline LEGIONNAIRE

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2010, 02:58:39 am »
I searched and couldnt find the buildalong thats why i asked.
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Offline Pat B

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2010, 11:05:12 am »
Patrick(Jackcrafty) has a few build alongs but not necessarily Sioux. Look on page 5(stone age privet...) and page 6(Apache style and California style) Lots of excellent info.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline Traxx

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2010, 02:41:09 pm »
Most all the Sioux arrows i have seen,were of 5/16 diameter and even smaller.The ones that were larger,were usually barrel tapered.I believe it was done to adjust spine.

Offline LEGIONNAIRE

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2010, 04:05:33 pm »
Thanks for claryfying Traxx!!
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Offline Hillbilly

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2010, 07:34:35 pm »
I'm with Todd-most of the old Plains arrows I've seen illustrated with dimensions have had 5/16" or even 1/4" shafts. They were usually reduced from a larger shoot with a bulbous nock left raised.
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Offline JW_Halverson

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2010, 11:47:20 pm »
The thing that I found odd about Siouan style arrows was that they didn't make use of the helical twist natural to the feathers....all those shown in Billy Berger's recent article on Smithsonian collected bows showed straight fletch.  I went back to some of the originals I have access to and sure as heck...straight fletch.  Huh.  Why do you suppose that was?
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Offline Pat B

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2010, 01:06:03 am »
Because of the shape and texture of the feather a straight fletched arrow will still rotate when shot. Only a couple of turns in a normal length shot(15 yds +/-) but they still turn. The longer fletching must add enough surface area to compensate for the short height.
 A way to tell how much rotation you are getting on your arrows...tie a thin thread to the point end of your shaft with the thread hanging down. Now shoot the arrow at a target and count the number of rotations the thread has made around the shaft.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline JackCrafty

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2010, 12:42:50 pm »
The Sioux arrows that you find in museums were mainly for buffalo hunting....so they are made in one piece from flexible shoots.  The thick end was toward the nock.  The shaftment, where the fletchings were placed, was tapered and the nock was bulbous with a V-type notch cut in.  The widest part of the shaft was at the nock.  The next widest part was about in the middle.  The nock could be up to 1/2" diameter and the middle of the shaft could be up to 3/8" diameter.  The thickness depended on the material used and the spine required.  Arrows made from red osier tended to be thick and those made from dogwoods were thinner.

The poundage of the bows was usually about 50lb but could go as high as 80lb or as low as 40lb.

The tips of the shafts were tapered to about 1/4" dia. in the area where the arrowhead was attached.

Almost all Sioux arrows had 3 wavy, shallow, shaft grooves running up and down the shafts between the arrowhead wrapping and the forward fletch wrapping.  The forward fletch wrapping was usually a single, wide strand of sinew laid down in a spiral similar to a "candy cane" stripe.  This left gaps in the wrapping about as wide as the strand of sinew.

The shaftment was painted with bands of water-based paint or stained.  The fletching raged from 5-1/2" long to 9" long and laid on straight... with wrapping on the ends and not glued down in the middle.  Sometimes the feathers were painted or stained as well.  Raptor feathers were preferred.  Sometimes the rear of the fletchings extended past the nock.  The average length of fletchings was about 6".
« Last Edit: September 09, 2010, 12:47:38 pm by jackcrafty »
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Offline JackCrafty

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2010, 01:04:17 pm »
Most Native American arrow-makers west of the Mississippi laid the fletchings on straight.  Sometimes the feather quills were intentionally straightened with heat but most often the feathers were large raptor feathers that were already straight, especially the tail feathers.  Both types were often mixed (tails and wings) and also different species were mixed on the same arrow.  The only thing that mattered was that the "curl" was the same for all the feathers on the arrow.

Arrows will spin regardless of way the fletching is laid on.  Straight fletchings don't spin the arrow as fast as helical fletching, that's all.
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Offline LEGIONNAIRE

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2010, 04:36:57 pm »
great replies, very helpful. Thankyou Jack!
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Randy

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #13 on: September 27, 2010, 04:21:38 pm »
What kind of penetration would one get with a 50# bow and 24" x 1/4 inch dia. arrow?  Even with a small obsidian point I can't imagine a deep boiler room shot causing a 1500 pound bison to pile up.

Offline Thwackaddict

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Re: sioux arrows!
« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2010, 04:26:32 pm »
Randy i think you would be surprised,close range ,sufficient energy and small diameter shaft.I'd say it would bury em to the fletching ;) JMO
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