Author Topic: To JIG or not to JIG that is the question??? VERY FUNNY VIDEO AT BOTTOM!!!  (Read 7401 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline DustinDees

  • Member
  • Posts: 192
  • the kingdom of bahrain, deployed
Re: Need info on jigs VERY FUNNY VIDEO AT BOTTOM!!!
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2010, 01:58:42 am »
lmao! dont be that guy
“Do not spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; remember that what you now have was once among the things you only hoped for.” – Epicurus
Put your hand on a hot stove for a minute, and it seems like an hour. Sit with a pretty girl for an hour, and it seems like a minute. That's Relativit

Offline Hardawaypoints

  • Member
  • Posts: 322
Re: Need info on jigs
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2010, 08:41:10 am »
I think they used a device of some type.
Can you flute to the tip with direct percussion or in direct percussion? The answer is yes but show me someone who can do it consistently...
The characteristics of a direct and indirect percussion flute flake scar are different then a flute flake scar left by a jig. Look at the artifacts, most cumberlands show the small ripples on the face near the tip of the point were the flute flake released. Very rarely will you get the ripples with direct or in direct percussion and most flutes with a jig that don't push the flute clean off the tip and stop abruptly will have these small ripples.
If primitive man could build simple machines to build the pyramids and Stonehenge etc., I'm sure they could have come up with a device to flute points. Such a device would probably have been made from bone and wood and could not last the test of time. and since the Paleo Indians had no written language theres no way to know for sure


Nobody does know for sure.  I know a master knapper who has only ever hand-fluted his points and while he doesn't produce Cumberlands regularly, he can do it.   I have seen some Clovis flute flakes which had been recovered from archaeological digs that were in one piece, when jig flute flakes tend to go to pieces.  Ancient man had the same brain as us and I think it is unrealistic to think they couldn't have developed a jig, but why go through all that if you can do it by hand?  I guess we'll never know.

Jim
Luck counts, good or bad.

Offline AncientArcher76

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,113
To JIG or not to Jig that is the question??? VERY FUNNY VIDEO AT BOTTOM!!!
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2010, 01:22:51 pm »
I understand both sides and there are always going to be 2 sides on certain topics.  I know many master knappers some will use a jig and some wont.  Its the way it goes.  I think if I were going to produce them for a display or to sell them I would want every advantage I could get.  Its not to say they will not break using a jig but if it means getting clean flutes then why not?  It also like the issue of being a primitive bow using bells and whistles like rattlesnake skins, pistol grips, laminates..... its take know how and talent to do any one of those things including the use of a jig.  Anyway to jig or not to jig!

Russ
Time, dedication, cuts, tons of broken rock, a wife, and perhaps a few girlfriends are some of what it takes in becoming a skilled flint knapper!!!
 
"Ancient Art"  by R. Hill

Offline Hillbilly

  • Member
  • Posts: 8,248
  • I like tater tots.
Everybody has different motivations and reasons for knapping, or any other hobby for that matter-and nothing is right or wrong. Some people simply want to make the most perfect points they can. You can take a rock, slab it up with a diamond saw, grind it to shape and cross section on a machine, then run a pass of pressure flakes and flute it with a mechanical jig or notch and serrate it with diamond files, and wind up with an absolutely perfect point that makes people go wow. And there's nothing wrong with that if that's what you like doing, but you might miss out on a bit of the magic that makes knapping so attractive to most people, and you might not learn a lot about how and why things were done the original way. Another person might work nothing but tough quartz rock with abo tools for the enjoyment and challenge of trying to figure out how it was done and never make anything that will make people ooh and ahhh. And that's fine, too. Most of us are somewhere in between. I do think that I'm much more impressed by a hand-fluted point than a jig-fluted one, even if it doesn't have flutes running out both tips. Most original Clovis points didn't have long, exaggerated flutes anyway. The people who made the Cumberland points may have used some kind of lever, or maybe not. I certainly doubt that a nomadic hunter would carry a big bulky mechanical contraption around just to flute points with. If they used anything mechanical, I would say that it would have been something like Swoose's forked stick method of fluting that could be done on the spot from local materials. If your family only makes one style of point for a couple thousand years, you probably would get pretty good at it eventually. :)
Smoky Mountains, NC

NeolithicHillbilly@gmail.com

Progress might have been all right once but it's gone on for far too long.

Offline leapingbare

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,028
    • http://www.flintknappers.com/jessewright/
Quote
If your family only makes one style of point for a couple thousand years, you probably would get pretty good at it eventually.
well said.
Mililani Hawaii

Offline jamie

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,387
  • born again pagan ,dirt worshipping heathen
Was gonna mention the forked stick but once again steve beat me to it. =) and again some of us like to do things the hard way. Been using copper boppers for the last week and couldn't figure out why I wasn't gettin my points as thin as I usually do. Went back to antler and stone and bingo thin blades.
"Man is a tool-using animal. Without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all."

waterbury, ct

Offline AncientArcher76

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,113
I hear u Jamie I made a few copper boppers and have been getting ok but for some reason I take cleaner flakes using a hammerstoneI need to find what Im going to use and stick with it!

Russ
Time, dedication, cuts, tons of broken rock, a wife, and perhaps a few girlfriends are some of what it takes in becoming a skilled flint knapper!!!
 
"Ancient Art"  by R. Hill