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Offline gmc

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HHB Question
« on: June 20, 2010, 04:25:49 pm »
If you're Daddy out there, Happy Fathers Day!

I have some general bow making questions with regards to HHB. I tried a little kids bow out of this stuff a few months back and found it really hard to work and no doubt didn't have it dry enough or didn't follow my bow making instruction manual properly  >:D. The stuff gave me the impression that it could have been tied in a knot to slowly unravel itself over time.

Thought I'd give it another shot with a little stave that's 58'' long about 1.5 wide (all I got). The density feels just a little under Hickory, and I will obviously bend it through the handle (I have no problem with that). Having never worked with the wood before, other than one failed attempt, my question is should the sapwood be removed or just build a bow. I'd like to try leaving a few layers of stapwood for the contrast, has anybody tried that one?

What's the general procedure here with regards to sapwood (what's everybody else doing out there)? Here's a picture of what I have to work with.

All comments appreciated.

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Offline sailordad

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2010, 04:29:05 pm »
hhb as in hop horn beam?

peel the bark like any other white wood,then that your back of your bow
all the hhb i have is so fine ringed i wouldnt want to chase it
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i always wanted a harley,untill it became the "thing to ride"
i ride because i love to,not to be part of the crowd

Offline gmc

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2010, 04:45:54 pm »
Yes, as in Hop Horn Beam. This stuff is thick ringed with a pretty thick pithy outer layer with about 4 rings worth of sapwood. Wouldn't be no problem at all to chase, I wouldn't even be asking had the last one not resembled stretch armstrong. All I hear is wonderful things about this wood, just trying to figure out what I maybe doing wrong.

Thanks, Mike.
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Offline sailordad

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2010, 05:14:12 pm »
wow  ??? never seen hhb like you described
maybe wait untill others chime in
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i always wanted a harley,untill it became the "thing to ride"
i ride because i love to,not to be part of the crowd

Offline Pat B

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2010, 05:54:23 pm »
Like Tim said, with HHB just remove the bark and use what's under it for the back.
  Are you sure what you have is HHB. I never noticed the heartwood being so dark. Can you post a pic of the bark?
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Offline gmc

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2010, 06:08:04 pm »
Pat:
Already debarked what I had but there is story behind it anyway. The generous lady that allowed me to cut the tree had worked for the forestry department several years and even at that rate she had to show me in the book to confirm. She actally got the book out while I standing there to prove it with the leaves. The leaf growth was early during April but there was enough to ID the tree, enough to convince me, anyway.

It was about a 4 inch diameter tree standing straight amongst a bunch of locust. I actually thought it was locust to start with.
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Offline gmc

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2010, 06:26:42 pm »
No pictures with the bark on but I did find the sister split. A few more pictures....




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Offline PatM

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2010, 06:48:39 pm »
I  have seen maybe one HHB log with the quantity of heartwood that your last picture shows. It seems incredibly rare for most stave sized HHB to ever produce anything but the smallest amount of heartwood. I have seen it more in larger trees cut for firewood.
 Is the first picture from the same tree? I have never seen HHB with thick rings or even thinner rings that I would contemplate chasing.
 Definitely leaving the underbark ring intact is the typical method for this wood.
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Offline gmc

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2010, 07:02:50 pm »
PatM:
Yes, its the same tree but in direct sunlight so it does portray the wood a bit darker than it really is in the photo. The first picture is pretty much spot on to what it looks like. Wished I hadn't tossed the end piece that I cut off, it still had the bark. Not sure what else it could be if not HBB.

Thanks for your response.
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Offline sailordad

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2010, 07:52:03 pm »
ive got some hhb in the garage but none of it looks like that
i'll go get a pic or two and post it for ya,bark and wood,sorry i dont a have a leaf to show
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i always wanted a harley,untill it became the "thing to ride"
i ride because i love to,not to be part of the crowd

Offline bcbull

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2010, 08:08:54 pm »
AFTER LOOKING VERY VERY CLOSE AT THE PIC S I DO NOT BELIVE THIS TO BE HHB  I THINK WHAT YOU HAVE IS A VERY VERY GOOD PIECE OF E R C  IV MADE SEVERAL OWS OUT OF  HHB AND ALL IV GOT HAS NEVER HAD A SAP ON IT  AS  THE ONE IN UR PIC S I DO IAGREE WITH ALL THE OTHER S  PEEL THE BARK THERE S UR BACK ALL THE HHB IV GOT HAS ALSO COME OUT OF ILL  WE NEED TO GET DEAN MARLOW ON HERE AND ASK HIM   BROCK
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Offline mullet

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2010, 09:32:09 pm »
 I've only made one HHB bow and it is posted this month. It sure didn't look like that. Looking at that wood, I don't think it would take the kind of bend I subjected the 1 1/8" wide piece of wood I used.
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Offline gmc

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2010, 10:12:56 pm »
I can not believe I found the end cut from the log but I sorted through the wood pile long enough to find it. Here is both side and top view of the end piece. Glad I sealed it that day, the bottom side is black.

Thanks for the help. Hope this solves the mystery.



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Offline sailordad

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2010, 10:56:46 pm »
well heres the bark



a look at the wood,this was from a log that was 8" diameter



the back after bark removal.the pic doesnt show it but it has alot of valleys etc in the wood pretty much where the cambium is still apparent



the rings,if you can see them  ;)



hope this helps
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i always wanted a harley,untill it became the "thing to ride"
i ride because i love to,not to be part of the crowd

Offline gmc

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Re: HHB Question
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2010, 11:57:48 pm »
Hey thanks for posting those pictures :). There are apparent differences in the two ???, I will leave a couple layers of sapwood on the back just to try something new and build a bow out of it and see what I end up with.

Thanks again for everyone's help.
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Central Kentucky
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