Stave to bow

[stickthrower]

I am working on my first bow.  I keep going back to Georges site for reference.  I was really hoping I would find my 1st volume of bowyers bible, but I couldn't find that.

I have now reduced the stave alot, and got it down to where I am actually floor tillering it.  I was shocked when I took a layer off, and was able to bend it.  It was amazing to realize that I am really getting my first bow going and part way finished. 

I have noticed though that I have twice now had to split a chunk off with my hatchet because of a split on the end of the stave.  I wasn't sure if I would have to split that off or not, but figured that where the split was, would have caused issue when it was closer to being finished.  I have the bow a bit long right now, and will have to reduce the length a little bit closer to time.

I have heard some people say that a first time bow maker shouldn't use a draw knife (and I don't have one yet either), so I am wondering, now that I have it down to this point, and I need to start bringing in the sides of the bow, what should I use to do that?  I have not started to thin it down yet, but am hoping that I can get the width reduced a bit more.  At the point where the bow is at now, not sure how I should do the limbs.  One has a bit of a wave to the grain, so that side could be a bit interesting, but I like how the charactor bows look, so I am okay with that.

Any thoughts on this would be helpful.  I will put a picture of the bow on so you can see where I am at right now, and see if you have any thoughts of what I am doing right, or what I should be doing differently.

Picture one is the current depth and width of te bow with my big thumb holding it up.

Picture two is a closeup of around the handle area.

Picture 3 is a view of the overall bow right now.

I am hoping to have the draw at about 55-60 lbs.  I have read one place where you take the draw weight you want and add 20%, and another place said take your draw lenght, adouble that and then add 20%.  Which way should I go to make the bow the correct lenght?  I think both numbers are close, but not sure if I should be going for one more than the other.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Nathan

[attachment deleted by admin]

[George Tsoukalas]

Nathan, I think you should use a draw knife. No power tools yet though. I don't know who told you not to. Let's see what else until you get one. You could use a knife as a scraper and scrape the sides. But that's tough work. 3 Rives has drawknives. The one I use I inherited from my Dad. I'm glad you are using my site. Jawge

[Del the cat]

I use a variety of tools, I find a smoothing plane is handy on the edges as it gives a nice long controlled even sweeping cut.
Always alow an inch spare on either end of a bow, as while you are working it (especially with an axe) the ends will get damaged and have a slight endency to split. A bit of extra sealer on the end grain wouldn't do any harm as they can still be drying out a bit even if the stave has been seasoned (I use pva)
Del

[nclonghunter]

You are close to finishing that bow. I would suggest a rasp type tool and then a cabinet scraper....go slow you don't have far to go..

[stickthrower]

 I went out and picked up a draw knife and a surform rasp.  I tried out the draw knife, and was having heck of a time using it.  So I put that aside and grabbed the surform.  I can now see why people love this thing so much!  I was amazed at how quickly I was taking wood off.

I am still floor tillering it right now.  I am blown away how quickly it the surform took wood off, and how quicklyit changed how quickly the bow has started flexing.  I think I am going to have to go out this weekend and get a couple things to make a tillering stand to start checking it that way. 

I will post some more pictures when I am a little farther along.

Thanks for all the help everybody.

Nathan

[yazoo]

if you were using the drawknife with the bevel up you will have problems...remember bevel down and it will cut smooth,,mike

[Orkraider]

I haven't used a drawknife, but everyone else swears by them. I have used a surform, as a matter of fact, that's the only wood removing tool I used on my first two bows. I'm not suggesting that's the right way to go, but it's what I had to work with, and it did the job.

I know the one thing I mean to get my hands on, (and I"m kicking myself know, just spent 2 hours at the hardware warehouse store place and totally forgot) is a farriers rasp. It looks like it would be an awesome addition to the surform.

Best of luck, and I can't wait to see this bad boy done and shooting.

[Jay]

 I use my farrier's rasp for most of my work. They eat through my hickory fine but not tooooo fast. I enjoy building almost as mush as launching (loosing   ) arrows.

Have fun !!
Jay

[gstoneberg]

My draw knife is like an old friend.  Bevel up and it removes wood like crazy, too fast most of the time.  Bevel down, like Mike suggested, and it's a power scraper...my favorite way to chase a growth ring.  Osage and a draw knife go well together.  I tried it on hackberry once and had a much more difficult time.  Rasps and the like are fine on the bow belly, but I'd never use them on the back, just a scraper and draw knife.

Be real careful any time you're amazed at how fast a tool is removing wood.  You're 60# bow will become 30# faster than you can blink.

Good luck!
George

[stickthrower]

Well, I am pretty sure I was using the draw knife bevel up, but I wasn't getting it to bite very well.  So I am not sure what I was doing wrong. 

I used th rasp and was doing one heck of a job on the belly.  I went from barely bending when floor tillering to it bending decently floor tillering.  So I am going to try to go after it again on the belly and then I am going to be making a tillering stick so that I can go to the next step.

Question though:  Do I need to cut the knocks before I start tillering it on the stick?  Or can I just tie it on about about where it should go?  I still have the bow a bit long for what I am planning on having, but left it long in case I screw up. 

I am taking a guess, but the bow is still probably up in the 80# range right now.  It takes almost all I have to get it to flex.  So I know I need to thin it down some more, but am wondering where I need to stop with the floor tiller, and move to the tillering stick.

Thanks,
Nathan

[sailordad]

Nathan, i just noticed your sig line says "Sartell,Mn."
hey neighbor, i am in st.cloud

[stickthrower]

Hi neighbor!  How you doing way over there?!    

Okay, first off, THANK YOU for letting me know I was using the draw knife wrong!  I flipped it and WOW!  Huge difference!

Second, I am a little concerned at this point.  I am still kind of floor tillering; mainly just sitting one end on the ground, grabbing the top and pushing the middle to bend it; but I am noticing that the bow is already taking some set.  I would guesstimate at this point that it is maybe 2-3" of set right now.  I have not put a string on this yet or anything else.  Am I pushing too hard when I am bending the bow that is causing this?  Or what is going on that I have this going on already?

I heard a big crack when I was working on it earlier tonight, but when I looked closely at it, the only thing that had happened was a little bit of the underside of the bark popped up.  So I removed that, and didn't have another cracking sound the rest of the time I worked on it.

You can see on the two pictures the set.  Not really sure what to do at this point.  If I should just keep going and see what happens or what I should do.

Thanks
Nathan

[attachment deleted by admin]

[John K]

What kind of wood is it ? and how long ago was it cut ? Is it still green ?

[Pappy]

Same question as John K ? It must be green,if so straighten it up and put it in a dry place for a
while. As far as draw knives I know it might be bass akwards but I use it bevel up,had no one to show me so that's how I started ,I have since try the other way when everyone told me how wrong I was but I still  always go back to bevel up.  Works for me. I also want mine razor sharp.
   Pappy

[stickthrower]

It is hickory, and definitely not green.  It was seasoned prior to me getting it, and it sat for probably close to a year here in MN prior to me working it. 

It is a bit long right now, about 5 or 6 inches longer than I think I want the final bow to be. 

I don't know if for my first bow if it is too narrow, it is currently about an inch wide.  I don't plan on really bringing that in any.

Would it be bending like this if it had been standing up prior to me splitting off the stave I am working on?  I don't think that the whole stave is curving, so I am really not sure.

The draw knife was working amazing well last night once I flipped it over.  I couldn't get to work bevel up.  Maybe now that the bow is all smoothed out now, it would work better bevel up.  I just assumed that I would use it bevel up since it sat closer to the wood that way.  Oh well.  At least there are great people on here to help me figure it out!

So, again, thanks all!  I am feeling kind of stuck now, not knowing what way to go now.  I really want to keep working on it right now, but don't know if I should continue at this point. 

Tp be perfectly honest, I really figured I would have brokein the bow a long time ago, not had it still holding up and actualy looking like a bow!  I am pretty excited to see if I can finish it!