Quick question Please

[chuckp]

I have a very basic question to ask. When looking at a stave or a board, I'm looking for straight grain. Where on the lets say board should the grain be straight?
Should it be the back, bellow, or edge?
Thinking whitewood here.

[half eye]

      If your going to get a board from one of the stores look for grain as straight down the board as you can get it. Ideally it will be straight down all 4 sides. That is not likely to happen but try to get is as close as you can....just my opinion.
half eye

[Josh]

Just like halfeye does is the way i do it... I try to get a board with straight grain down all 4 sides, but mainly concentrate on the grain on the edges now.  I want the lines on the edges to be as parallell as possible you can always use a cloth backing if you are worried too much about the grain.  Check out Jawge's site in the Buildalong section.  I think it is at the top of the section now.  Good luck!   

[chuckp]

I'm reading the final chapter in the trad bowyers bible vol. 4.
Tim Baker says on pg. 307
"Select a board whose face displays perfectly straight ring lines, with no neanders, islands or kinks. Pay no attention to ring lines on the side of the board as they can be misleading.
See my confusion!
By face, I assume Tim is refering to the back of the bow opposite the belly.

[George Tsoukalas]

Thanks, Josh. There are 3 board cuts as seen from the butt edge. There's flat sawn , rift sawn (//) and 1/4 sawn (||). For flat sawn and rift sawn you can look at the face of the board and what it does the edge grain will do too. That's not the case with 1/4 sawn. You have to look at the edge grain and for 1/4 sawn it has to be completely straight grained or there will be problems. I always look at the edge grain for all cuts. Then I look at the face to make sure there are no knots or other imperfections. If I don't find a suitable board I walk. On flat and rift sawn I allow 2 run outs or run ups per limb for a 50-55# bow. If there's more you can back the board with silk,  linen or burlap. So yes you can look at the face but not for 1/4 sawn you have to look at the edge and  for it there can be no run outs or run ups. There's more info on my site including a red oak board bow buildalong. Jawge
http://georgeandjoni.home.comcast.net/~georgeandjoni/

[Josh]

this is what I think... if there is a little run off on the back of the bow and the side grain is paralell, I will pick that board over a board that is parallell on the back with sketchy side grain...  I just seems to me it will separate at the different growth rings running diagonally on the side before it will separate on the grain run off along the back to me.  the grain lines on the side will separate under the strain in my opinion... I drew a pic to show my reasoning behind this.  I would pick board number two every time over board number one.  Seems like you would have a better chance at separation in drawing number one at the red arrows...  JMO

EDIT:  ...Most of the boards i deal with are rift sawn

[attachment deleted by admin]

[chuckp]

"I always look at the edge grain for all cuts. Then I look at the face to make sure there are no knots or other imperfections."
So straight parallel lines along the edge are what I need to look for.
Those pictures are worth a thousand words.
I'd imagine that when choosing hickory staves, the same holds true.

[George Tsoukalas]

That's what I do. I look at the edge. Yes, what the edge does is what the face will do for plain and rift sawn. !/4 sawn look at the edge. But as I mentioned you are allowed 2 run outs per limb for 50-55# bow and more if you back it. I make bend in the handle board bows. No glued on handles. That's much easier for the beginner. I can suggest widths if you are interested. Jawge

[chuckp]

Please do Jawge, I made one quick attempt at a red oak board and it cracked at the handle section while attempting to string it after long string tillering.
I'll probably hold off trying again till summer when I cut down some hickorys I picked out. Unless I go the red oak routine again.

[n2huntn]

Great illustration Josh,
That could be marked for the how to and bulid along section because its asked so much.
Jeff

[George Tsoukalas]

Follow that buildalong on my site. If you want 45-50# you can go 1 3/8 in wide out to mid limb tapering to 1/2 in nocks. If yo want 50-55# then go 1.5 in wide. Some find that width difficult at the handle but I never did. The handle will will bend if you leave it 3/4 in thick but yo have to leave it 1.25 or 1.5 in wide as mentioned above. Please ask if you don't understand. Jawge

[George Tsoukalas]

Josh, in your first picture because the face grain is straight the edge grain will also be straight. Jawge

[George Tsoukalas]

In the 2 nd pic because the face shows a very slight run out (board milled at an angle) the edge should also.Face reflects edge except for 1/4 sawn. 2 nd pic is still a good board. Jawge

[Frode]

chuck,
The only thing I'd add to all that's been said, is, if you're new to board bows (or even stave bows), go ahead and plan on cloth backing at least the first one.  I used linen, because it's cheaper than silk  , and I like the look.  You can back with a lot of fiber based materials, from burlap to cotton to brown paper, with varying degrees of success and ease, but linen is easy, and it works!  Cloth backing can make the difference between a quick failure and a bow that holds together long enough to see and correct a tillering issue and prevent a failure.  I'm a noob myself, I've made six bows since the end of last year, all linen backed, and all have survived (so far  ).  Some of the boards I used were probably OK, but some of them were only probably probably OK.  It's a Huge confidence booster to get that first bow up and shooting!
Good Luck, and if no one's said it yet, post many pictures!
Frode

[George Tsoukalas]

Josh, thanks for taking the time to post the picture. Jawge