BBI handle separation.

[Tim B]

  Has anyone built a BBI that had the handle pop on the tiller tree and find out that the handle started a small separation from the bamboo? You can barely see it but it is definitely there. Can it be wrapped with anything and glued to save it? 

[Pat B]

Sounds like your bow is bending into the handle area and that is why the handle glue joint separated. You can try to remove that handle carefully and replace it with a multi-lam handle of thin slats cut at different lengths. If the handle area is not bending too much this might just fix you up. If not, the only fix I know is to use a handle material the will flex with the bow like leather or cork.
   I have a bow("Trouble Maker") that is boo backed hickory that I have repaired the handle area 4 or 5 different times. It shoots very well but the handle squeaks when I draw...and wince! This bow started out as a boo backed hickory but when the hickory began to fret I trapped the boo back, ground down the hickory to 1/8" thick and added an osage belly. When the handle first popped off I put a silk wrap set in super glue(popped again)...then a rawhide wrap was added(popped again) and finally a hemp cord wrap set in Massey finish(2ton epoxy thinned with acetone) and that is how she is now.
   You may be able to just wrap the riser with silk thread or hemp cord set in glue or possibly just with rawhide but be prepared for other options.

[islandpiper]

Pat, you said, "It shoots very well but the handle squeaks when I draw...and wince!".....any chance that is your shoulder squeaking?   

Ain't it fun watching the years go by? 

I had a similar problem on one bow, followed Jawges advice and laminated some shoe-sole leather and then ground it down to shape, wrapped in seine-twine.  I usually try to stay away from bendy handles. 

piper

[Ryano]

Here's a rawhide handle wrap I did on a bow with a experimental splice. The glue joint was fine on this bow I just did this for extra insurance.
I can't imagine it ever coming apart. Its fairly thick raw hide cut to about a 1/2" wide strip a couple feet long. I soaked the raw hide in warm water and coated the handle with titebond 3 and wrapped the raw hide around the grip and trimmed the edges so it looked good. Once it dried I coated it with titebond again a couple times to seal it and then some polyurethane with the rest of the bow. When it dried the raw hide shrunk up so tight I can't imagine the handle ever popping off...or in this case the splice failing. 

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[snedeker]

I've had that problem too with really heavy tropical woods like ipe and bulletwood.   One other idea, in line with Pat's suggestion, is for the first thin lam in contact with the core to fade out longer - say 1.5", onto the limbs, to get the mid section bending less

Dave

[Tim B]

Here is a picture of the separation. It starts at the shelf and goes into the fade a little bit.

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[Pat B]

If you will notice the handle and limb are on the same plane. If you start out with a thicker core at the handle area then reduce it from the fades out the limb the handle sits above the plane of the limb and it is less likely to bend thus not causing the handle to pop off or separate. Another idea is to add a "power" lam between the backing and core to stiffen up the handle area.

[Bent Rig]

Its most likely because the piece of wood used that was glued for a handle piece on wasn't long enough , by the photo's given . A handle should taper down to the limbs beyond the fades about 13" 0n most bows , many make that mistake and suffer ill fate .

[Rich Saffold]

Tim, Hows it going? You have some good advice here, and I wanted to add one more thing since you live nearby and the Ipe you get probably comes off the same boat .

Sometimes this wood feels works and sound dry if you tap it,and often the limbs also will get stiffer out at the tips as it may continue to dry ever so slightly, but enough to change the tiller on the limbs causing the bow to want to bend more in the grip. Especially with a change to drier air like we had lately.

Another trick I occasionally use on bows with a built-up grip is buy one of the 2x2"s  for the bow. This is thick enough that the center section will never flex, and then I glue on a small cap to shape as I like..This is almost bulletproof.

If you ever come to SB and want to shoot some let me know. Most mornings I'm working in the wood shop behind Tri-County Produce at the bottom of Milpas st. near the beach and just past the railroad tracks.

Rich

[Tim B]

I sure do appreciate all the help and information you guys have given me. I originally bought a 2x6 of Ipe from Mayan Hardwoods here in my area and cut it into 3/8" strips so I wouldn't waste as much material taking down the belly of the limbs. It also makes it easier to glue in perry reflex at that thickness and my last one worked just fine but it ended up a gift to a friend. I have never tried a power lam before and am not quite sure if it is another strip of wood between the core and backing the full length of the bow or just added in the handle area.

[Tim B]

Rich I would love to drive up and meet you and check out your bows. You aren't far at all. Would weekend mornings work for you, if not I have every other Friday off.

[Rich Saffold]

Tim, I might go shoot Saturday morning some if you want to, and Friday mornings are good too. Just let me know when.
Rich 284-8865

[african man]

here is a photo of a "power lam" I use in my laminated bows , as Pat says it's a piece of wood that goes between the backing and core to stiffen the handle area , it feathers out a few inches past the fade out





 hope this helps

Chris   

[Tim B]

Thanks Chris, that looks really nice. Did you just plane the ends down to fade out?

[african man]

ground them down on a beltsander with another piece of wood held on the back to stop it from flexing at the tips , never tried a plane , but I'm sure it could work

good luck and let us know how it goes

Xris ...