INFO ON BIG OBSIDIAN BLADES

[Blacktail]

I might have asked this before.but i cant remeber...this also might just relate to people of california and oregon..but,i am trying to gather up info on big obsidian blades...i really want to study this  and the tools that where used back then..i am trying to get photos that are up close,the length,width.also the history behind such big blades...the only two people that i know that might have some info would be emory coons and jim winn...so,if any one has come across any sites or writen down info that would be great...i have been looking on the computer but only come up with a handle full of info...thanks again john

[leapingbare]

They call erm Dance knifes i think.
 There is a video of Jim knapping one on u-tube i think.

[cowboy]

I read an article by Waldorf on giant obs blades found in a burial mound and he describes replicating one. Been awhile but I think the mounds were in the central US but the materals came from the NW obviously. Can't remember exactly where I found that but was online.

[Blacktail]

man, paul. i wish you would have keep that.thats o.k....i will look around on the web with the info you gave me and see if any thing comes up.even thought you dont have the info that is still good news to hear.thanks john

[billy]

HEy John,

The BIG obsidian blades were usually wealth/status symbols for the elite.  They were used by northern CA tribes like the Hupa, Karok, etc.  They are normally known as Dance knives because they were used in ceremonies.  They are usually a little narrower in the middle of the blade and widen a bit toward each tip.  I've seen some pics of some that were 9-12" long, although I saw a photo of one that was about 22" long.  That's the longest one I've ever seen.  I've seen some that are solid black obsidian and I've seen some that were banded orange and black.    Steve Allely knows all about them (he's replicated a few for collectors) but he's not on PA.  Emory Coons and Jim Winn would probably know  more about them than me, so if you can get in touch with them they might be able to divulge more info.  hope that helps. 

[Blacktail]

hello billy,that is some of the info i was looking for...i found some writing from ray hardwood that is about ted orcutt...that is prodley the last person to make the big blades with traditional tool.i read some where about an explorer in the 1800s that stayed with a hupa tribe.and in his writing he stated that they where only for ceremonies and that the person that made them had a hidding place and only brought them out at night and after the ceremonie they would put them back in there hidding place.so,i guess the blades can be in lengths of 9 inchs or bigger... thanks john

[Blacktail]

hey billy,i forgot to ask...do you remeber if any of the blades you seen where pressure flaked...i have been wondering about this.thanks john

[flecha]

Blacktail, If you can get to the Favell Museum in K-Falls, they have MANY examples to look at.  Also, if you can get access to the ones that were found in the burials at the Gold Hill site, on the Rogue, you'll get some good information.  I think most of that dig was conducted by the U of Oregon prior to the '64 flood.

[Blacktail]

hey flecha,thanks so much...i didnt even know that there was big blades found in that area..even when i lived over there...i will be looking into this alot...know if i can just find  the info..thanks alot for the help....john

[billy]

HEy John,

Yeah the big blades were pressure flaked, some extensively.

[Blacktail]

thanks again billy..on some of the blades i have seen its kind of hard to tell.john